Tonight on Close Up ` the bell tolls for Christchurch's historic cathedral. Will the city lose its heart? The furore over forced adoption as more shocking stories come to light. And from poster boy to Ironman ` what's driving Terenzo Bozzone in his latest quest. Due to the live nature of Close Up, captions for some items may be incomplete. ONE News captions by Faith Hamblyn and Desney Thorogood. Close Up captions by Hugo Snell and Oliver Sutton. Good evening. So after 150 years, that's it. What's left of Christchurch's landmark cathedral is coming down. It's too damaged, too dangerous. The experts say it can't be saved. On the face of it, a practical, sensible decision. But is it the right one? We'll discuss that shortly, but first Alexi O'Brien canvasses opinion in Christchurch. ARCHIVE: From a stone laid in 1864, the cathedral grew to be the centre of a modern, provincial capital. And not just the centre, the heart. ARCHIVE: On national occasions, on civic occasions, on sorrowful occasions, on joyful occasions... While a shake in 1888 caused some damage,... ARCHIVE: The spire of the cathedral has come to grief. ...the cathedral stood proud in the square named for it for almost 150 years. # Cathedrals,... # cities with cathedrals. # Stained glass windows. # It's the centrepoint of the city, and I think it's the one thing the city should be trying to save. Quite teary about it, really. I'd quite like a bit of it left there as a memorial. And if these walls could talk, the tales they'd tell ` of queens and kings; of politics and personalities; of protests, pets and promises. Peter and Beryl, you are now husband and wife. BELLS TOLL JOYOUSLY But now the bells have been silenced, the windows shattered, and just a shadow of its former self, the cathedral stands empty, broken. If you were to take it down and rebuild a replica, to me that seems the wrong thing to do, because you could never replicate the feeling of the place. Any time you lose something that you love, there is a deep, deep sense of loss. But also hope. I think, 'Well, this has happened, and now we have to move forward.' While the last rites have been said for this building, many around the country are waiting to see what phoenix will rise from these ashes. The Bishop of Christchurch, Victoria Matthews, accepts today's decision as right. Councillor Aaron Keown, on the other hand, plans to defy it. They are with us. GOOD EVENING. VICTORIA, HOW INVOLVED WERE YOU AND HOW CONVINCED IT WAS THE RIGHT DEICSION? I AM CONVINCED THAT THE RIGHT DECISION WAS MADE. I WASN'T INVOLVED FOR EVERY STEP OF THE WAY. IT WAS DELEGATED AUTHORITY IN EARLY DAYS. IN THE PAST FEW DAYS, I HAVE STOOD IN WITH THEM PARTLY BECAUSE THE DEAN WAS PART OF THAT CIRCLE. LAST NIGHT I CHAIRED THE STANDING COMMITTEE AS THEY APPROVED THE RECOMMENDATION AND ACTUALLY TURNED IT INTO A RESOLUTION. WHAT DROVE THE DECISION PROCESS - CAN'T BE REBUILT OR IS IT JUST DIFFICULT? IT'S SAFETY. NINE DAYS AGO I STOOD AND HEARD 185 NAMES READ OUT. THANK GOD THERE WERE NONE. ONE YEAR AGO I STOOD AT THE FOOT OF THE CATHEDRAL AS THEY LOOK ED FOR BODIES. THIS BUILDING IS SAD AND SICK AND DANGEROUS WE NEED TO BRING IT DOWN TO WHERE IT IS SAFE. IT MUST BE INSPIRATIONAL. WE CAN RETRIEVE HERITAGE ITEMS AND BUILD SOMETHING SAFE AND INSPIRATIONAL. THIS IS OUR EIFFEL TOWER. IT'S A CHANCE FOR CHRISTCHURCH TO SHOW WE CAN DEFY THE EARTHQUAKE BY SAVING THIS BUILDING. I'VE HEARD FROM EXPERTS THAT IT CAN BE DONE. I THINK IT'S MORE THE PRICE ATTACHED FOR IT. IT'S TIME FOR A MORATORIUM ON THE DEMOLITION. LET'S HALT DEMOLITION UNTIL THE PUBLIC HAS THE DEBATE. I DON'T THINK IT'S UP TO THE CHURCH TO STUMP UP THE MONEY. THIS BUILDING IS BIGGER THAN THE CHURCH; IT'S ABOUT THE PEOPLE OF CHRISTCHURCH. IF WE'RE NOT WILLING TO PUT THE MONEY, THEN FAIR ENOUGH. THE DECISION'S BEEN MADE AND THE DEBATE'S BEEN HAD. WHY NOT MOVE ON? THAT'S WHAT THE GROUP OF ENGINEERS WHO LOOKED AT THE BUILDING SAID. I HEARD THIS MORNING ON THE RADIO IT COULD BE DONE AND IT WOULD BE 100% ABOVE CODE IN A FEW MONTHS. YES, THE BUILDING MAY BE RUINED, AS WOULD OTHER BUILDINGS, BUT NO ONE WOULD DIE. IN 10 MONTHS, HOW SAFE WOULD IT BE? LOTS OF SPOTS WON'T BE SAFE IN THE NEXT 18 MONTHS. YOU'RE PREPARED TO RISK PEOPLE'S LIVES? NOT AT ALL. IT WOULD BE A STRICT BUILD OPERATION. IT'S ABOUT A BUILDING THAT IS BIGGER THAN ALL OF US. BUT CERA HAS SAID IT'S RELUCTANT TO LET THAT HAPPEN BECAUSE OF THE DANGER TO HUMANS FAIR CALL, CERA IS THE WATCHDOG. VICTORIA, DO YOU THINK PEOPLE ARE ON YOUR SIDE AND UNDERSTAND? OF COURSE IT'S SPLIT. IT'S NOT 100% ONE WAY OR THE OTHER. I'VE SPOKEN TO PEOPLE OF DIFFERENT AGES AND THERE IS FAR MORE COMMITMENT TO THE SITE THAN RETAINING THE BUILDING AS IT WAS, AND CERTAINLY IF THE HERITAGE PEOPLE DON'T WANT A REPLICA BUILT... THERE ARE THOSE WHO WOULD LIKE TO SAVE ONE PART OF IT, AND I RESPECT THAT, BUT I AM NOT CONVINCED WE COULD DO THAT SAFELY. AARON, I WONDER IF YOU DON'T DEFY THE EARTHQUAKE BY GETTING ON WITH IT AND MOVING FORWARD AS OPPOSED TO NOT LETTING GO. PART OF ME CAN'T LET GO, BUT I CAN SEE THE FUTURE OF OUR CITY. WE SHOULD HAVE SOME NON-NEGOTIABLES. I BELIVE THE CATHEDRAL IS NON-NEGOTIABLE. IF THAT MEANS WE RING-FENCE IT UNTIL ALL THE EARTHQUAKES ARE OVER AND DON'T LOOK INSIDE, SO BE IT, BUT LET'S NOT RUSH TO PULL SOMETHING DOWN THAT CAN'T BE UNDONE. WE NEED TO HAVE THAT DISCUSSION BEFORE WE RIP IT DOWN. AARON, AND VICTORIA, THANKS. Coming up after the break ` outrage of forced adoption continues. And the top triathlete who has to push through the pain barrier to claim top Ironman status. We were swamped with feedback last night after our story about forced adoption. For the first time, Merilyn McAuslin publicly told the story of adopting her son out in 1973 and the role of her mother and government departments in forcing her to give him up because she was unmarried. It's sparked debate about whether an inquiry is needed for women forced to give up their babies. We'll discuss that shortly. First, some of the feedback we received. Their words are read by actors. I don't want an apology. What I really want is for the children that we gave away to know that back then we had no choice. The DPB was something I had never head of, and we were classed as 'bad girls'. We didn't give them away because we didn't love them. It was because we did. Speaking as a birth mother of 1970, I would rather the government didn't bother apologising to me, but as for the other people ` agencies, churches, doctors, nurses, specialists, social workers, family and friends ` who treated me like a piece of excrement during this time of pure hell and afterwards, then I would like an apology from you. You know who you are. I did my nursing training at Waikato Hospital in the late 1960s, early '70s. Mothers were left labouring without support. They were treated like evil beings. I can still remember how helpless and disgusted I felt as a 17-year-old to be ordered to treat these young women in this way. The issue now is whether resolution of any kind is possible for the women scarred by the forced adoption process so long ago? Julia Hartley Moore, who defied the odds as a teenager and kept her baby back in 1969, is with us along with adoption researcher and writer Dr Anne Else. IS AN APOLOGY NEEDED, AND IF SO BY WHO? I DON'T THINK THAT AN APOLOGY IS NEEDED. I THINK IT WOULD MEAN NOTHING TO THOSE WOMEN. BUT I DO THINK AN APLOGY FROM THEIR FAMILIES. AT THE END OF THE DAY, IT'S THE FAMILIES THAT MADE THE DECISION. I WAS WELL AND TRULY UNDER THE CARE OF MY FAMILY. 'IF YOU LOVED HER, YOU'D DO THAT.' I WENT THROUGH ALL OF THAT, THAT THEY WENT THROUGH. I WAS TOLD TO GIVE HER UP BY AUTHOTIYIIES - I THINK THE FAMILIES NEED TO APOLOGISE. WHERE DO YOU STAND, ANNE? I'M NOT SURE. I THINK IT WOULD BE SENSIBLE TO LISTEN TO MOTHERS. I THINK POSSIBLY SOMETHING LIKE THE TRUTH AND RECONCILIATION COMMISSION. THE PROBLEM IS IT WAS SUCH A WIDESPREAD STATE OF MIND, AND EVEN THE FAMILIES WHO SAID YOU HAD NO OPTION BUT TO ADOPT OUT, THEY ACTUALLY THOUGHT THEY WERE DOING THE RIGHT THING FOR HER AND THE CHILD. PEOPLE GENUINELY BELIEVED IT WAS BEST. ESPECIALLY IF THEY BARELY SAW THEM, THEY COULD GO ON AND HAVE A 'NORMAL LIFE' THAT'S THE INTERESTING THING, ISN'T IT? THERE WAS NO INSTRUCTION; THERE WAS NO GOVERNMENT DEPT. IT WAS HORRENDOUS. IT WAS SHOCKING THE WAY WE GAVE BIRTH WITHOUT PAIN RELIEF. SHOVED IN ROOMS TO HAVE BABIES, BUT IT STILL COMES DOWN TO THE FAMILY. I COULD NOT HAVE KEPT MY CHILD. YOUR DAD STOOD BEHIND YOU, DIDN'T HE? HE WASN'T A BOY, HE WAS 25. MY FATHER SAID, 'IT'S CARNAL KNOWLEDGE FOR YOU OR YOU MARRY MY DAUGHTER' MY FRIEND - HER PARENTS WERE HORRIFIED. WE DID HAVE A CHOICE, BUT WE WERE BULLIED AT THAT TIME, AND IF YOU DIDN'T HAVE SUPPORT OF YOUR FAMILY, AND IF YOU DIDN'T HAVE YOUR FAMILY'S SUPPORT, AND IF YOU COULD SEND A CHILD OFF TO HAVE A BABY ON HER OWN AND THEN EXPECT HER TO HAVE A GREAT LIFE, HOW DO YOU DO THAT? THERE WAS A WHOLE LEGAL STRUCTURE THAT BOUGHT INTO THAT. THE SHOCKING THING FOR ME WAS THAT WE STILL HAVE THE 1955 ADOPTION ACT. THE ACT THAT TREATED WOMEN THE WAY THEY DID. DOESN'T THE ACT TELL YOU MORE ABOUT ATTITUDE THAN THE ACT ITSELF? THE POINT IS THAT UNLESS WE CHANGE THE ACT, THOSE ATTITUDES REMAIN ENSHRINED BECAUSE THAT ACT IS STILL BEING USED. THERE HAVE BEEN 25 YEARS OF TRYING TO GET IT CHANGED BECAUSE IT'S STILL GOT ALL THE THINGS THAT YOU HAD THEN ` SIGNING YOUR BABY OVER AT 10 DAYS, NO INFORMED CONSENT, NO COUNSELLING. THEY'RE ALL STILL THERE. WHY DIDN'T PEOPLE STAND UP IN THE 1970S? WHY DIDN'T PEOPLE SAY, 'YOU'VE GOT TO BE NUTS?' WELL, BECAUSE IT WAS THEIR PARENTS. THE PARENTS` THE STIGMA WAS ENORMOUS. THE STIGMA WAS TO GET RID OF IT, 'REMOVE THE SHAME'. THE SHAME WAS THE BABY, THE DAUGHTER. 11 MONTHS AFTER MY DAUGHTER I HAD TWINS AT 16. I WAS A 16YRO GIRL WITH A BABY. THE SHAME WAS STILL THERE WHEN I HAD MY SECOND BABIES, BUT I WAS STILL MARRIED. YOU WERE TREATED NO DIFFERENTLY IN THE HOSPITALS. JULIA HARTLEY MOORE AND ANNE ELSE THANK YOU Coming up ` will it be third time lucky for Ironman competitor Terenzo Bozzone? And we're live in Herne Bay where a local pharmacy has a new lease on life. You may recall our story last August about a popular Auckland pharmacist given just two weeks to pack up her shop after 19 years. Well, she vowed to fight the landlord, and we'll find out how she fared shortly. First, Matt Chisholm with the story so far. I want to go and punch his lights out. What he's done is wrong. You'd seriously go round and punch his lights out? I sure would. Do you know where he lives? Do you know where he is? Cos if I could, I would ` believe me. They were talking about this man, John Sandler, a landlord who asked the local pharmacist to move on after 19 years' service. We received a fax from her lawyer saying that they would not be renewing the lease and they would be putting another pharmacy company in here. To add insult to injury, that landlord would have a stake in the new pharmacy. There's an interest there. A financial interest? There's money going in to it. It's just so wrong that it should be allowed to happen. So wrong in fact that Herne Bay locals saw red and rallied behind their long-serving pharmacist. It's just people just being pushed about, and that kind of pissed me off. With support like that, Geraldine opened a new pharmacy just around the corner and was preparing to take on her landlord head to head, but would he go through with his plans? Seriously? I actually don't know about that. He didn't open his pharmacy, more than likely based on public opinion. And today Geraldine's opening her second, effectively blocking John Sandler out of Herne Bay completely. With us are pharmacist Geraldine Phillips and ardent supporter Dame Catherine Tizard at the opening of Geraldine's new pharmacy just five doors down from the old one. LADIES, GOOD EVENING TO YOU. HELLO! WHAT DO YOU MAKE OF THE COMMUNITY SUPPORT? IT'S BEEN FANTASTIC. WE'VE BEEN BLOWN AWAY IN A COULD OF GOODWILL. WHY DOES HERNE BAY NEED TWO? WHAT'S WRONG WITH THEM? THAT'S WHAT THE COMMUNITY WANTS. THEY LIKE THE LOCAL PHARMACY. WHY DID I GET INVOLVED? BECAUSE THIS IS PART OF MY COMMUNITY. AND THIS IS ONE OF THE MOST FANTASTIC THINGS. IT HAS GIVEN HERNE BAY A SENSE OF COMMUNITY THAT WAS LACKING. NOW WE CAN TALK TO ANYONE ABOUT THE PHARMACY. 'I KNOW, WASN'T IT AWFUL? AND ISN'T IT GREAT NOW?' COULDN'T YOU HAVE GONE TO PONSONBY? OF COURSE NOT. WE'RE HERNE BAY. TOO FAR AWAY. WHAT HAPPENS NOW, GERALDINE? YOU'VE GOT TWO PHARMACIES NOW. THAT'S RIGHT. WE'RE JUST HERE TO HELP EVERYBODY. WE'D LIKE TO THANK CLOSE UP FOR THEIR SUPPORT. THANKS TO CLOSE UP, BECAUSE YOU STOPPED HIM IN HIS TRACKS. CHEERS TO YOU TOO. HAVE A LOVELY NIGHT. GERALDINE PHILLIPS AND DAME CATHERINE TIZARD. THANK YOU It'll be a long day in Taupo tomorrow for competitors in the postponed and now shortened NZ Ironman. Among those waiting and going over their tactics will be Terenzo Bozzone, one of our top triathletes who's fought his way back from injury in a bid to secure his first ever Ironman title. Jehan Casinader with the man and his mission. It's fun. It's the adrenalin. You go down a hill at 60, 70, 80km/h, around corners. And I'm pushing it day in, day out. It's a great life, but I work harder than anyone out there. When he's spinning his wheels, flapping his gills, or pounding the pavement, Terenzo Bozzone is a hard man to catch. We find him in the Waitakere Ranges on a five-hour training ride. This is where legends of the sport are made. The blood's pumping as they hurtle down the hill, but just around the corner... The power from what he was pushing in the pedals flew him over the handlebars. It's the worst crash Terenzo has ever seen. It was that gruesome that I almost threw up. What was going through your mind at that moment? (CHUCKLES) 'Here we go again.' And just like this bike ride, Terenzo's career almost came to a crashing halt. Meet Terenzo Bozzone, a South African boy with Italian heritage who grew up in NZ with a very Kiwi dream ` to become an ironman. The dream started to come true at high school. The teen triathlete snagged junior world titles. ARCHIVE: The 18-year-old, long touted as a future star of NZ triathlon got the winning break on his pursuers. He even ended up on Celebrity Treasure Island. HORN BLARES I really enjoyed it. It was very controversial. I guess I was a big shot back then. Now at 26, it's time for Terenzo to prove he's more than a schoolboy success story. He's begun by turning his stardom into sponsorship. What's it like having your face on a cereal box? It wasn't my goal in life, but I thought it would be cool. Do you wake up in the morning and think, 'I am a brand'? That's what you are. That's what Tiger Woods is. That's what Michael Jordan... Lance Armstrong. They're brands. Is it true that you've called your body the moneymaker? (CHUCKLES) What happens if the moneymaker stops making money? It's all over. Terenzo missed out on a spot at the Beijing Olympics in a shock decision by selectors. How gutting was that? It was soul-destroying. I wanted to go to the Olympics since I was a little kid. I had always dreamed of going to the Olympics. Then came another blow ` an Achilles heel injury threatening to ruin his career. You do go through periods where you have little niggles, but they usually go after a week, two weeks. And this one didn't? I knew I was capable of winning these races, but I was finishing fourth, fifth, sixth place. I mean, it was... it was scary. And I tried not to face it every day. I tried to find something else to do so I wouldn't have to face the fact that this might be the end. But after surgery in September, Terenzo is back to his gruelling training schedule, spurred along by his biggest supporter, his partner, Kelly. He lives his life out in the open. He doesn't really keep anything to himself, so kind of what you see is what you get. But despite the hype, Terenzo is yet to win the Kiwi Ironman. For three years, Terenzo has come second to 39-year-old Cam Brown. But he isn't fazed by his older competitors. I know that I will work harder. I know that I am smarter than them, and I know I can do what's never been done. Terenzo has no degree and no plan B. Triathlons are his life. But he knows each ride, each run, each swim could be his last. While it may not be the last day of your life, it may be the last day of your career. The scaled-back event, now a half-Ironman, is due to start at 8 o'clock on Sunday morning ` weather permitting. That's NZ Close Up for the week. Enjoy your weekend. Goodnight. Captions were made possible with funding from NZ On Air.