Tonight on Sunday ` a story of optimism and determination and lots of love. Hunting, fishing. Until he was struck down. I'm not giving up. But there's new hope ` It's not a cure. Nobody's saying it is a cure. ...controversial and unproven. < So would you advise people to take this treatment? Hello! And the queen of gastro porn. Slut spaghetti. Nigella on men,... Everything is about a come-on. ...on self-image... Men don't like skinny women. ...and critics. < They accused you of being a sugar-sprinkled monster. Kia ora, I'm Miriama Kamo. It's a medical mystery that confounds doctors and sufferers alike ` multiple sclerosis. It's a devastating, drawn-out ordeal for thousands of NZ sufferers. Now there's a debate raging about a new and controversial procedure. The question ` does it work? Some Kiwi patients are so confident of the benefits they're spending big to cross the world for treatment. This report from Ian Sinclair. (BLOWS WHISTLE) CONTEMPLATIVE MUSIC Raymond and Debra Henderson ` So we're going in here. ...Kiwis in New York determined to delay the inevitable. You've got to give it everything. You've got to give it a go. You've got to give it everything. You've got to give it a go. What's the alternative? > Death; um, a lonely life; kids with no father; no fun. (CHUCKLES) And it's that determination that's turned them to a highly controversial treatment, one that has split the medical world. < Would you advise people to take this treatment? < Would you advise people to take this treatment? No, I wouldn't. At issue ` the creeping paralysis of multiple sclerosis. We really need people to not be so dismissive or argumentative about this and to start looking at the evidence in cooperation, rather than slinging darts back and forth. It's gotta end. I'm not giving up. Sort of, I'm still... I'm still fighting it. CONTEMPLATIVE MUSIC This is the Raymond they both want back ` the typical southern man. He's never been someone to sit around. He` When he doesn't work, he was out hunting; fishing; shooting,... (CHUCKLES) yeah, motorbikes. And that's how Debra has known 43-year-old Ray for most of their 20 years together. If he had a job to do, he would do it, um, and he didn't stop until it was done. That was then,... OK, and cut, because I'm gonna hit the wall. (CHUCKLES) ...this is now. Ray is unable to do anything for himself. Sorry, is it too fast? Sorry, is it too fast? Mm. The body may not work, but the brain certainly does. Good? Good? Mm. Ray's already dreamed up a gadget to improve his life ever so slightly. It's got a bolt under here so it can... this can turn around and go here and be a left-handed rather than a right-handed or... A good way of keeping occupied, keeping your brain going. A good way of keeping occupied, keeping your brain going. Well, and keeping your... crotch dry too. crotch dry too. (LAUGHS) This father of five was a plasterer by trade, outdoor adventurer by nature. Pretty full on, seven-day-a-week kind of guy. Ray helped design and build their Cromwell home. Fortunately, Ray had built the passage wide, with no thought of what lay ahead, no thought of multiple sclerosis. I wasn't looking. Ooh, Jesus. > Oh. Oh. It's broken. > Oh. It's broken. > Back door. It's just a name that... as, um,... a label I suppose, to, uh,... the horrible condition that just... robs you slowly. A horrible condition that has this once active man totally dependant on Debra. Yeah, you're talking death in the end. I mean, they don't say that MS kills you, but conditions associated with having MS kills you. And, you know, I want him around for a long time. (CHUCKLES) WHEELCHAIR MOTOR CHUGS Oops, sorry, Ray. And that was enough to hit you, was it? Release, reset. Just let me... Making life in a wheelchair all the more difficult to live with. Just about tried to electrocute. (SCOFFS) Paralysis began with a pretty ordinary symptom about eight years ago. (INHALES) Just feeling fluey was... was probably the start of it. (CHUCKLES) Buried head. 'Yeah, yeah, it was, uh, sort of falling off the ladders and doing... 'doing wee things that is not the normal.' It's, um... Yeah, no, I was pretty... It was a learning curve at the time. It was... Yeah, I was a bit of a loss of what's going on. After tests, doctors broke the news. Raymond learned he had MS. Keep my head above it. (CHUCKLES) When I was told the diagnosis, I didn't know anything about it really, so I was... just... just thought, 'Oh, well, how do we get over this?' So of course you get the medical books out and you have a wee look and think, 'Oh, I don't like that.' The first clue came up on the web. Deb discovered a new procedure, called CCSVI, or Chronic Cerebrospinal Venous Insufficiency. A bit high for me to be... You all right? It's a controversial procedure. Some say there's no proof it works. Has that got you? But Raymond is sure it does. He's already had it done twice in Melbourne. So what was the progress you made as a result? > So what was the progress you made as a result? > The main one was the choking. Talking to you now, I could just stop breathing, sort of, and just choke, and... to the point of, uh, about to pass out. And I read something else that said, um, a lady's father had died from choking with MS. Scary for you? Scary for you? Hugely scary. Um... Yet the choking disappeared, they say, after the first operation in Australia. Especially that last week before we had it done the first time, um, it was a couple of times a day, every day. But he's still a man stuck in a wheelchair, and inside Raymond, the old adventurer longs to escape. I'm not giving up. The mountains, the scenic beauty of Central Otago, are a constant reminder to Raymond of the active outdoor life he once led, though he does believe there is a chance at least that he could get a partial recovery. But that chance lies half a world away. PINK FLOYD'S 'BREATHE' Three years on from the Melbourne treatment, their hopes lie in New York, where doctors have refined the technique. How much is this trip going to cost you? Um, the procedure itself costs, uh, US$9000. Uh, plus we've got airfares. You're not rich people, are you? > You're not rich people, are you? > No, we have borrowed from Mum. We are coming home to... to debt and, um,... my wee job, so... (LAUGHS) But we will get there. It is a lot of money, but it's, um... you've gotta try. You know, what do you do? You've got to give it everything. You've got to give it a go. Next up ` New York, and what can this treatment do for MS sufferers? The ability to, uh, walk without a cane, uh, within an hour of the treatment. OK. Now we're putting the catheter in the jugular. In a New York clinic, Dr Salvatore Sclafani uses imaging equipment to peer inside the veins of Kiwi Raymond Henderson. OK, now we're gonna go in the left side of the head. His belief ` a controversial one. Uh, you've got a blockage on the right side. That the creeping paralysis of multiple sclerosis may be linked not just to the nervous system, but to the circulation of sufferers. I mean, it's not a cure, nobody's saying it is a cure; it's just helping to, um, alleviate some of the symptoms that he's got. It's been a long journey for Raymond and Debra ` from Central Otago... to Brooklyn and Dr Sclafani's clinic. Follow my finger. Don't move your head. As Dr Sclafani explained to us, he treats a condition known as CCSVI. Turn your head to the left. Hold it there. Resist me. Could you explain to us what is CCSVI? Could you explain to us what is CCSVI? Sure. It is related to obstructions of the veins that drain the brain and the spine. Those obstructions have, uh, some symptoms that are rather specific to the obstructed veins ` confusion; uh, memory difficulties; fatigue; um, temperature intolerance; imbalance. What results would you expect to see, Dr Sclafani as a result of this, uh... of this procedure? Uh, I would hope for... reduction in pain; uh, improvement in swallowing, so he might not choke; um, less spasms would be a good opportunity; and if we could get some strength in his hands ` just his hands ` that would be triumphant. That's a balloon. It's on a catheter. By using the balloon to widen Raymond's vein, Dr Sclafani hopes to improve the blood flow out of his brain. That's how you can get a big balloon in the little hole. Raymond is conscious during the procedure. I'm gonna blow up the balloon again, Ray. Tell me if it hurts a lot, OK? It's very important. OK, you tell me that. OK, Ray, turn your head straight, please. Good man. But not all doctors agree with Dr Sclafani. < So would you advise people to take this treatment? < So would you advise people to take this treatment? No, I wouldn't. Like many of his colleagues, Auckland neurologist Ernie Willoughby believes the theory that narrowed veins can cause MS is just that ` a theory. I don't think there's evidence of the phenomenon being real. Uh, my concern is ` from what I have seen in recent reports, including what I see on the, uh, websites of people that are doing the procedure ` that often, uh, people are applying treatments to normal kinks and narrowings of veins that's a common, normal phenomenon. Can you squeeze my finger? But Dr Sclafani says there is science to back his method; patients are fully informed. OK. I then give them, uh, a dossier of about 10 pages of references in peer-review journals that have shown the association of CCSVI with multiple sclerosis, that have shown benefit in a number of clinical processes, uh, after treatment of those veins. Could you tell us some of the... some of the benefits you've seen from this procedure? They include return of colour vision; the ability to move a foot that hadn't been moved in four years; uh, the ability to, uh, walk,... when... without a cane, uh, within an hour of the treatment. Now, there are other patients who have much more modest improvements. For example, a patient in a motorised wheelchair who has to have help to get on the toilet, who can now make the transfer to the toilet alone, that's a huge dramatic improvement in that, you know, patient's dignity and quality of life. < Would you accept that? I think people do get improvement in symptoms, even bad symptoms, uh, from time to time. Uh, it's very difficult, often, to determine what's caused it. Watching baseball? You like baseball? But what of Raymond? Only hours after treatment, he's happy. How you doing? How you doing? Yeah, it's a little tight round the neck, but... Tired? Tired? My arms, yes. It's been` It's a long day, right? It's a long day, right? Big day, yeah. According to Dr Sclafani, it will take time for any benefits to emerge. Yeah, I think you need to rest. You know, have a good night. Yeah, I think you need to rest. You know, have a good night. Yeah. Yeah. Gotta eat something. Did you eat? Yeah. Gotta eat something. Did you eat? Nah, not yet. Ray and Debra realise there are no guarantees. If there was nothing mainstream out there for Ray, because of the type of MS that he's got, then I think that he should be allowed to take the chance with his own body, to be able to do what he wants to do with it. Thank you very much. It's been an amazing experience. Thank you very much. It's been an amazing experience. Yeah? How did it compare to the last one? Pretty much pain-free. (CHUCKLES) Yeah, you take care of him, huh? Yeah, you take care of him, huh? Yeah, I will. Yeah, you take care of him, huh? Yeah, I will. All right. For Debra, the thought that she might have denied Ray a second chance, by not coming to New York and seeing Dr Sclafani, would be unbearable. Pleasure to meet you. We've got to give it a go, otherwise we're always wondering 'what if?' (LAUGHS) Raymond and Debra are now on their way home. Raymond says he feels a lot better. Of course, as we know, it'll be a while before they know the full effects of the treatment. But they're happy with even the smallest gains, and we keep a watch on Ray's progress. We are hoping for you, Ray. When we come back, we put a very personal question to Nigella Lawson. One of the reasons that a lot of women love you is because you can make them feel OK, < that it's not wrong to have a bit of shape on your bottom or, you know, on your hips. Now, ever heard of gastro porn? It doubt it's for me, but believe it or not, it was coined by the flirtatious and sexy Nigella Lawson. Tonight we're at home with the queen of cuisine, where she talks candidly about men, self-image, the critics, and, of course, food. Ross Coultardt with Nigella Lawson. JAZZ MUSIC On a quiet street in upmarket Chelsea in London, I'm about to meet the queen of cuisine, Nigella Lawson. Hello! Pleased to meet you. Ross Coulthard. Pleased to meet you. Ross Coulthard. Pleased to meet you. Come in. Ooh, and you've come bearing gifts! Ooh, and you've come bearing gifts! I do. Ooh, and you've come bearing gifts! I do. Aha! I do. I'm not going to reveal what I've got in here just yet. Nigella's shows are normally shot in a studio replica of this kitchen. But today, I'm getting an exclusive glimpse inside her Chelsea home. < Are we the first media crew to actually film inside your home? Apart from my own crew, yes. Apart from my own crew, yes. < Yeah. It's not too hot, even for a man, I think. It's not too hot, even for a man, I think. Yeah. No problem. Most women love going clothes shopping, but I love food shopping. It's the joy of consumption without having to go to a changing room. There's no doubting Nigella's passion for produce. Oh, wow. Oh, wow. Hi. Good morning, sir. Good morning, sir. Ah. I love this. Smashing. Smashing. It does feel sacred, doesn't it? Smashing. It does feel sacred, doesn't it? Oh, it does. What a friend she has in cheeses. I'll need a huge wedge. I think I might just buy the whole lot. If I didn't eat, I would be in a constant bad mood. I mean, I only have to be late for a meal and I get tetchy. Don't worry, this won't hurt at all. In fact, it was Nigella who cheekily coined the term 'gastro porn'... My special tasting spoon. ...for her flirtatious, sultry delivery. Slut spaghetti. Plumptious beauties. Gorgeous golden gleaming gloop. Mmm. A large part of your attraction is ` let's be honest about it ` your sexuality. Is that part of you as a person? See, I don't think I am a woman; I just think I'm me, and I'm always quite surprised that people say to me, oh, that I'm flirtatious, because you can see I'm not. I'm quite intense, and I'm quite intimate, and I feel that what people mistake my... my intimate urgency for some sort of a come-on, but you know, I am very fond of men, I love men, but I also am always amused, endlessly amused, at, um,... the way men always think everything is about a come-on. Mmm, look at this. Don't you wish? Mmm. Now 52,... Can I tell you, Nigella, you are an absolute dish on camera. Can I tell you, Nigella, you are an absolute dish on camera. (LAUGHS) ...and you wouldn't know it to look at her, Nigella has never wavered in her belief that cooking is a joy surpassed only by eating. I think I need to be alone with my scone. I really feel I can't pass up any opportunity for pleasure in life. I feel that's it's... it's a sin. So when people say, 'What are your guilty pleasures?' I say, 'Look, I feel that the only thing you should feel guilty about is not taking pleasure.' And the cocoa is so dark, so elegantly smouldering that a jaunty bit of milk chocolate is just right. I'd put to you that one of the reasons that a lot of women love you is because you can make them feel OK, that it's not wrong to have a bit of shape on your bottom or, you know, on your hips, that this fixation with being skeletally thin as a woman is ridiculous. And I don't think it makes them happy. As a woman, I always think that men don't like skinny women, but... it does occur to me that... the sort of men who like skinny women are not gonna go for me. You're a woman with curves, and you enjoy your body shape, don't you? 'Enjoy' is an odd way of putting it. I am at peace with it. I have a different relationship with weight than people do. Because for most people, they equate, uh, thinness with health, whereas I don't, you see. So I've seen a lot of people die of cancer, and they all get very, very thin. So I think somewhere in my mind, um, I think thinness, to me, can feel, uh, threatening. Some like it hot, and I certainly do. Her love of life is infectious. Oh, a lovely little shop. Oh, a lovely little shop. It is. It's like being in Italy. What are you looking for here today? What are you looking for here today? I don't know. I just come here to be greedy. I don't know. Even so, she can polarise people. It's caulibroc or broccoflower. Italians make a pasta sauce with it a lot. Critics ` she has a few. Fans she counts in the millions. < The London cabby that brought me in from Heathrow said, 'What are you here for?' I said, 'I'm here to interview Nigella Lawson.' And his face lit up in a huge smile, and he said, 'You lucky bugger.' BOTH LAUGH One of the things that shocks me, though, is there is in England a snideness, a tall poppy syndrome, that wants to pull you off your pedestal now that you've become successful. True? Do you not have that in Australia as well? Do you not have that in Australia as well? We do, we do. Yes, because it is actually an Australian expression, isn't it? Yeah. And I'm really struck, though, by how you're a celebrity chef, you know, it's a happy thing that you're bringing to people, and yet somebody wrote an article called I hate Nigella. It's a casual smearing ` a bit like the tabloids. They accused you of being a 'sugar-sprinkled monster'. They accused you of indulging in an 'orgy of innuendo', your 'pouting lasciviousness' and your ` I don't quite know why they have a problem with this ` your 'fondling of parsnips'. What's going on here? Why...? I don't know. I don't know. Why is somebody wanting to have a swipe at, uh, Nigella Lawson? Maybe that person absolutely perceives me like that. But why? But why? I don't know but, you know, maybe... And there is a way in which, um... This is the thing I find quite odd is that I am myself, so I'm sorry I can't be the, you know` If I can't person they want me to be, that is just how it is, and I am, you know, I... I am who I am. And thank goodness for that. No house is complete without a bloody good bottle of Barossa shiraz. Don't drink that today. I know. I feel we should, but then I might say things I live to regret. I know. I feel we should, but then I might say things I live to regret. (LAUGHS) Ah, beauty and food ` who can resist it? Kati ra mo tenei po. That's us for tonight. Uh, do check us out on Facebook ` Sunday TVNZ. We'll see you next week. Have a great one. Nga mihi nui. Hei kona.