E te ihorei o Raukawa, e te kaka tarahae, Ngarongo Iwikatea Nicholson, tenei matou e murimuri aroha nei ki a koe. Okioki mai ra i roto i te rangimaarie. Ko Mihingarangi tenei e tangi atu nei, e mihi atu ne. Welcome to The Hui, Maori current affairs for all New Zealanders. Coming up this morning ` with just weeks until parliament rises, we meet some of the fresh new faces vying for your vote at the next election. And he lost by the narrowest of margins at the last election, but does Hone Harawira still have what it takes to win back Te Tai Tokerau from a confident Kelvin Davis? He joins me in studio. Karahuihui mai. With just 90 days left until Aotearoa heads to the polls, a new wave of aspiring Maori MPs are about to sweep through your town, knocking on doors, shaking hands and kissing mokos all the in hope of making it to parliament. So what is their vision for Aotearoa? And what will they do with your vote? To discuss this, I'm joined now by three hopefuls. They are Green Party candidate for Te Tai Hauauru, Jack McDonald, Labour Party's Northland candidate, Willow-Jean Prime, and the Maori Party's man in Hauraki Waikato, Rahui Papa. Tena koutou katoa. ALL: Tena koe. Well, Willow, after the week that we've just had, what is it about parliament that attracts you? Well, for me, it's a position where, basically, you are making the laws, you're setting the policy and you're putting the budget to those things that are gonna make the biggest difference for the country. And I'm really excited this year to have that opportunity to represent Northland and all New Zealanders in parliament in that really important mahi. Ka pai. Rahui, you know, you hold such an important role with the Kingitanga. What more do you think you can offer as a politician? I see them in the same light. I see that the support of the kingitanga is about manaakitanga; it's about development; it's about the people. And so too, I think, is the opportunity for the Maori Party in parliament. You're inevitably going to be compromised at some stage when it comes to legislation and stuff. How do you hold the balance? You gotta do what's right for the people. And if it's right for the people, get on and do it. Mehemea he mahi pai mo te tangata, mahia. Mm. Ka pai. Jack, your third election campaign. You've been doing this since you were a teenager. How serious are you about it this time round? I'm really serious about getting into parliament this time round, and I have a real opportunity to do so and to stand up as a voice for rangatahi Maori in parliament. We can't take anything for granted, but with enough party votes for the Green Party, we will get more Maori in parliament, and we'll have a chance to actually change the government and deliver real progressive change for our people at the heart of the next government. I wanna just talk about something that Hone Harawira has said recently, and it's in relation to the problem with P and meth in his rohe. He suggests executing drug lords. Any support there, given you have a relationship with the Mana Party? One thing's for real is that drastic measures have to be taken because this is a whanau` That drastic? Well, I don't know if it's gonna be that drastic, but hey, this is what breaks the core of whanau ` is that one single thing. And if we can break that, then the whanau is going to be much better off. You're from the same rohe up there. Your thoughts on his solution? I don't think that's the solution that Northland Te Tai Tokerau needs. I don't think there's a silver bullet either to addressing this issue. But we do need it to be a core priority for our government. We need the resources. This is breaking our whanau apart. And it was the subject of our hikoi at Waitangi day this year. And I want to mihi and tautoko to those strong people that stood up to raise the issue. Mm. Jack? We know that Maori are significantly disproportionately affected by tough sentencing laws, so actually, Hone talking about bringing back capital punishment would actually be executing Maori more than anyone else. And so while I appreciate the massive concerns around P and methamphetamine in Te Tai Tokerau, I completely reject the idea of returning capital punishment to the law books. Good to know. Ka pai. Well, let's talk abut treaty settlements, cos we're in a very interesting stage at the moment. The waters between Tauranga Moana, Hauraki are particularly rough at the moment. Ngati Whatua, Ngati Paoa overlapping claims are causing tensions. You're the Hauraki Waikato MP. If you were to become that MP, which cab would you be in? Both, actually, because actually it should be an iwi to iwi agreement. And that's the core to this ` that the OTS and the Crown should stay out until actually the cross claims are dealt with by iwi. Because when the whanaungatanga's too strong, you can't differentiate whakapapa, you can't differentiate tupuna. And so when the iwi and the iwi come up with the win-win situation, that's when OTS needs to abide by the agreement. That's interesting cos that's almost what OTS is doing with Ngapuhi. They've stepped back, and they've said, 'You guys sort it out.' You're from up there. How do you sort it out? Well, I don't think that's what they are doing, actually. And they should have stepped back a long time ago to let us sort it out if that's what they thought the solution was. You'll know that I've been, obviously, in the Te Kotahitanga camp for eight years. In a mandate at Hapu Kaikorero, we successfully won a Waitangi tribunal claim against this mandate. We have, over the last 18 months, participated in the Maranga Mai process, which was taken out to hapu. It is for hapu to decide in this process. The crown has backed one group to the tune of more than $5 million. And to step back now after all of that work that we've done over the last 18 months, quite frankly, is just so frustrating. So almost the opposite ` step in. That's right. Step in and withdraw the mandate. The Waitangi Tribunal released a report that said that Ngapuhi didn't cede sovereignty to the crown. Yet, you know, the Crown didn't really accept that. The treaty minister said that's not quite right and the rest of it. What are your thoughts around whether the tribunal should be binding or not? Well, that was a seminal ruling, and the Green Party absolutely upholds the rulings of Waitangi Tribunal, and so we do think that they should be binding, and it shows the arrogance of this government, that they'll, in the next brief, as you say, completely dismiss those findings. And I mean, if you look at the Tauranga Moana and Hauraki case, if you look at Ngapuhi, both of those are examples of the Crown using the treaty settlement process to divide and rule hapu and iwi. So actually, the Greens support a full review of the treaty settlement process because we know that this isn't justice. And actually, the divisions that they're creating in this process actually open up new breaches of Te Tiriti, and we have to address that. Ka pai. I want to just move on to another subject. Rahui, we talk about the Maori Party being at the table with the National Party. I guess when you look at health, for example, what's been achieved in the last eight years with the Maori Party being at the table? Oh, there's been a whole lot. So, there's been programmes and initiatives. There's actually been some really good stats, and Whanau Ora is at the core of that. The Whanau Ora partnership... Which stats? ...between iwi and the ministries have shown that the commissioning agencies have done an awesome job. There's thousands of whanau that have actually been helped in that space. And hey, and that's with only two MPs. Just imagine ` if there's 10 of us, what sort of influence can we have? So which areas over the last eight years have improved for Maori under that regime? The people that are in impoverished states, the people that are in CYF's care with the launching of Mokopuna Ora, not only in the Waikato but in South Auckland. There's been almost 1000 families` But that's iwi. That's iwi-driven. Yeah, but that's iwi alongside the Crown. So that's a collaborative agreement that we struck and has actually been working really, really well. Do you agree there, Willow? Because more Maori kids in CYF's care than ever before. Yeah, I don't agree. I think that the gains that the Maori Party claim they have got by being at the table you have to weigh that up against what has been taken out of the system. Over $2.2B has been taken out of the health system. They vote for that budget every single year, so I don't know how you can vote for the giving of a small amount on one hand yet the taking, which is disproportionately affecting our people, because we represent in the high statistics of the worst health areas. So I think that that funding needs to be reinstated into the health budget. Let's quickly talk about Whanau Ora cos they've got a report coming out on Tuesday. We're not sure what kind of report or what numbers we're going to see there. Does the Green Party support Whanau Ora? Would you keep it? We do absolutely support the concept of Whanau Ora. And we do commend the Maori Party for pursuing that kaupapa in government, but actually, we've seen that the government hasn't committed the funding that's required to actually make Whanau Ora a success. And also the accountability and regulatory regimes aren't in place, and so you're seeing a lot of money going into administrative costs and actually not reaching the ground. So I think this is an example of where we need a new progressive government so that we can actually take the bold initiatives and actually make these kaupapa really real and not just tokenistic. OK. Private members bill. If you got into parliament and your bill was drawn, what would it be, Jack? Well, I'm really interested in drafting a bill around establishing a parliamentary commissioner for Te Tiriti o Waitangi because there are a lot of legislation that goes through parliament that doesn't get any scrutiny in terms of the treaty. Ka pai. Willow-Jean, have you got an idea? Well, obviously, I'm supporting 26 weeks paid parental leave for our whanau and at a minimum, so I would really like to see that done again. And hopefully we're in government and it won't get the financial veto. (CHUCKLES) (LAUGHS) Rahui? Ask the Greens. They voted for the budget too. No, we didn't, actually. Well, actually, you did. No, we didn't. So one of the things that's right at the core is (SPEAKS MAORI). It's about the eradication of poverty in all communities in Aotearoa. So what would your bill look like? Ah, it'll be, you know, increased support. It'll be more kanohi ki te kanohi support. It'll be more kaumatua support, cos it's not just the physical poverty; it's about the wairua poverty as well. Kia ora. Ka nui te mihi ki a koutou katoa. Thank you for joining us this morning. ALL: Kia ora. Kia mau tonu mai ra e te iwi, hei muri i nga whakatairanga, kei konei te taniwha hikuroa o te nota. Mana Leader Hone Harawira joins me next. 1 Kei te matakitaki koutou i a Te Hui. He lost Te Tai Tokerau in the 2014 election by the narrowest of margins ` just 743 votes. Now Hone Harawira is running a comeback campaign. But does the force from the north have enough gas in the tank to make it all the way to Wellington, or has too much water run under the Waihou Bridge? (LIGHT LAUGHTER) And will the wheels come flying off the Mana-Maori waka when they hit a parliamentary pot hole? To discuss all this and more, I'm joined now by Hone Harawira, leader of the Mana Party. Tena koe ata marie. Morena. Morena. You like my intros, eh? You always have a little giggle on the side. I do. Yeah, yeah. I have to address P and your suggestion that possibly we execute drug lords. Yeah, look, when I first went into parliament, I made a statement that I'd like to put all of the big tobacco executives up against the wall and shoot them for the damage that they're doing to my people. I went on from there to lead the parliamentary select committee on a campaign which is heading to making Aotearoa smoke-free by 2025. The first Western nation to become smoke-free. This is an opening salvo in a similar campaign against P. I see the devastation that it's causing in my communities right across Te Tai Tokerau. And I think we need to change the game plan. Stop talking about it and do something about it. So to be fair to you, since 2008, the Maori smoking rate has decreased by just 2%, but it has decreased for a long time. Is this gonna be your key issue ` P? Are you going to come into this` Oh, it's one of them. It can't be the only one. There's too many other areas where Maori need to be lifting themselves. But it's certainly one that I see affecting communities and families that we're working with through Open the Curtains, through the Tai Tokerau rugby league. through a whole lot of other areas, through Kura, through other groups in my community. Lots of Maori drug dealers... Lots of drug dealers are Maori. Would we be executing them too? I hope that when I get back into parliament, I can lead a Maori affairs select committee around the country to raise the issues of the damage that P is causing to Maori communities in a way that when we come back, parliament will understand exactly how important this problem is in our society and do something about it like we did with tobacco. Ka pai. Let's talk about a couple of bills before the house. Oranga Tamariki is the restructure of Child, Youth and Family. Marama Fox has been very vocal about the removal of the whanau clause and changing it to safety first. Then there's Te Ture Whenua Maori bill that you've called 'a poisonous cancer'. You've had a sit-down with Te Ururoa, but you said you're not 100% happy there's not been any major changes after your hui with him. How can you align yourself with a party like this and tell your voters to vote? (CHUCKLES) Look, we have a kawenata, which requires of us that we don't stand against one another in our different seats. That kawenata is being held to right to this day and will hold right through to the election. We also have a clause within that kawenata which allows us to be critical of one another's policies where necessary. And the Ture Whenua Maori bill was an issue I signalled before we even signed the kawenata. That's the one I hold to today. I actually stand alongside the Maori party on the issue of Oranga Tamariki, and I look at is as bureaucrats in Wellington rewriting a piece of legislation which is going to a whole lot of Maori kids. It's very much driven by Pakeha, and they just sprinkled a whole lot of Maori words over the top of it. So when you read the bill, there's words in it that don't actually mean anything ` Maori words that don't actually mean anything cos somebody just chucked them in. So you've got this relationship with the Maori Party where you're allowed to have a go at their policies but you're not allowed to have a personal attack at them and you're gonna hold hands until the election and who knows what happens after that. But leading up to the election, if they were to, say, vote for the Oranga Tamariki or pass the Maori land bill, you know, how can you tell your people that that's OK? Or what kind of comeback do you get? Do you get to sit down with them? And do they listen to you? Yeah, yeah. We get on quite well. We talk to each other. We agree. We disagree. But we` But does he listen? Does Te Ururoa listen to you? I think the important thing in this debate, Mihi, is to ask the question, 'What do I want to see for Maori?' What I want to see for Maori is Mana Maori motuhake. I can't get that with National. I can't get that with Labour. I can only get that with my colleagues, my brothers and my sisters from the Maori Party. And I'm more than happy to go to the Nth degree to make that happen. Sure, that means compromising on... strategy, but as long as we don't have to compromise on principal, I'll walk this path. Let's go back up North. And do so comfortably. Let's go back up North. Let's look at the Ngapuhi settlement. Which camp are you in? (EXHALES) I'm in the camp that's happy the Crown's gotten the bloody hell out of the way, quite frankly. I mean... So you think this is positive? Look, if there's 100 pounds of butter, every tribe up until now has only got 3 pounds of butter. Nobody ever got the value of their settlement. They only ever got 3%. Ngapuhi now have the opportunity to go back to the baseline of their claim, which is that Ngapuhi did not cede sovereignty. Now, if Ngapuhi did not cede sovereignty, that means to me, one, we don't have to accept a 3% of the value of our claim, two, we don't have to allow the crown to tell us who can speak for us. But it's gonna` And three, we don't have to allow anybody else to tell us what our future's going to be. We have to focus on getting ourselves together and not make the settlement the apex of our life, but make Ngapuhi the apex of our future, and the settlement is part of that. Northland Maori are the most impoverished Maori in the country. People like Dover Samuels, who was an original claimant, are getting on, and your claimants are passing away, so how long are you willing to wait for this settlement? I'm willing to wait until Ngapuhi are strong. And right now we're divided one with another. We're fighting with one another. We're not focusing on the most progressive good for the most number of Ngapuhi. We're fighting for the right to race down to Wellington to get the 3 pounds of butter. I don't want to be party to that. I want to be party to Ngapuhi being strong, bold, challenging and progressive. OK, so this election you're running against Kelvin Davis for the Labour Party, Godfrey Rudolph for the Green Party. I'm gonna ask you a really easy question. What are their strengths? Oh, look, Kelvin's a wonderful principal. He did a really good rescue job at Kaitaia Intermediate School. I'll say that. I've always said that about Kelvin. Godfrey I don't know very well, but pai ki te korero Maori, so (SPEAKS MAORI). Yeah, I can't really say much more than that. Ka pai. And what is your strength? Oh... When I'm out of parliament, I'm walking my talk. When I'm in parliament, I talk about the issues that are important and fight for them on the ground. Ka pai. Well, thank you very much for coming in this morning. Kia ora ra. Kia ora. Inangeto nei i runga i a Te Hui. Our highly informed, highly informative political pundits are here to give us their take on the take on the torangapu of the week. Okioki mai ra i roto i te rangimaarie. Hoki mai ano e hoa ma. Well, it's been a busy old week in the Beehive as our politicians felt the sting of election year scandal. Bill English's straighty 180 image has taken a blow after it was revealed he knew one of his MPs had allegedly made secret recordings of his staff, resulting in a hefty pay-out. And Labour found themselves embroiled in their own scandal when a group of disgruntled international students who were volunteering for the party complained over the quality of their accommodation at an Auckland marae and the quality of learning on their internships. To discuss this, I'm joined now by former Labour Party mover and shaker turned commentator Shane Te Pou and former press gallery journo turned consultant Scott Campbell. Tena korua. Well, what a week. And to top it off, Hone Harawira's suggesting that we execute drug lords. What do you make of that? It's Hone probably at his best, I think, causing noise and creating a bit of light on Hone. He needs to. You know, he doesn't have a lot of campaign money around him this time. He's a party of one. He's a party of one, so he has to make noise. And he's done that. And I think, you know, to give him credit, he spoke about the fact that he raised the similar sorts of issues around smoking, and then we had the smoking debate. Look, it's not gonna be accepted by everybody, obviously, but he's made some noise. Let me ask you about National, Labour ` which was the worst scandal? For me, I think Labour because it was about the very sense of being, about looking after, you know, visitors. I think that, you know, cheap accommodation at a marae was a bad look for them. I think this is probably the end of Matt McCarten's time in the Labour Party, which has been` Did the Labour Party throw him under the bus? Pardon? Did the Labour Party throw him... Yeah, I think they did, but he called the shots, you know. I don't know why they kept Matt after the last election. I like Matt, but you know, he was the strategic sort of maestro that saw Labour reach its lowest vote since 1908. We needed a fresh change, and we didn't get it. Do you agree? Do you think the Labour Party marae sort of scandal was worse than Todd Barclay? Yeah, I think it's hypocritical because you've got a party here who talks about standing up for people who are at the lower end of the spectrum. You've got people here are talking about trying to get rid of immigration numbers and around international students; then you've got them here volunteering and in really bad conditions. I think it couldn't have been a better end to the week for National because, to be fair, at the moment the National Party doesn't need to really worry about Labour. It doesn't really need to worry too much about Winston Peters. It needs to worry about themselves. They have to make sure that they don't look arrogant, and that is their main challenge. What we've got at the moment is we've had Todd Barclay. We've had Alfred Ngaro. We've had a few other issues that are starting to come out. Claudette Hauiti, Aaron Gilmore. At the end of this week, how's the prime minister looking? I think he's looking shaky. I think that that was abysmal in terms of how he handled the whole Barclay affair. But at the end of the day, amongst their 43%, 45%, Sorry, 43%, 45%, I don't think it's gonna make a heck of a lot of difference. Scott, you've been in the gallery; You know what it's like when those journos come throwing those questions at you and you're on your back foot. How do you think he handled the question line over the four days and then again yesterday with Patrick Gower on the Nation? Oh, pretty poorly. Obviously, I think the handling of this at the start was pretty rubbish. He must have known what was in the police document. He obviously did because he was the one who talked to the police about it. And for that office to not have expected that more information was going to come out after that first story from Newsroom, then that was silly. If they didn't know it was going to come out, he should have just come clean. Who is Todd Barclay, and what does it really matter? Was this a win for small broadcasters, you know, the online media, this week? Yeah, I think it was. And you know, they're quick; they're mobile. They're draining a lot of talent away from mainstream media, yeah. And I think it was good. And also they question deeper and more thoroughly, I think, than, on many occasions, mainstream media does. I think it was good. I want to come to you on our panel, our newbie panel. What did you make? Who was your favourite? Who spoke well. I think Willow-Jean is` I think she's class. I like Jack. I think he's got some really good ideas. And I think Rahui has moved from the politician on the marae to the politician in this place, a new marae. What do you think there? Well, I think that Rahui's not gonna win that seat arguing from a basis around Turangawaewae. This is gonna be won in Hamilton right up to Manurewa. And this is gonna be about jobs; this is gonna be about houses. And, whether he likes it or not, that link with the National Party, I think it's gonna sink the Maori Party. What do you think about the new faces ` Willow-Jean and Jack? You know, young, fresh faces? Yeah, I like them, but I didn't see any real solutions. I want real solutions for, for instance, the unemployment numbers in Northland. I think we need real solutions. For instance, growing that wharf up in Marsden there, creating 3000, 4000 jobs. I think we've gotta look at creating real solutions rather than policy talk. And I think they've gotta move beyond that. We talked really quickly with that group on overlapping our claims, and you are from the Tauranga area. Rahui's solution was to get the government out of there and let iwi settle it. What do you think about that? I think it's the right decision. I think it's the right idea. And Hone sort of said the same thing about Ngapuhi as well too. At the end of the day, when it's Tauranga, mana moana, mana Tauranga. But the idea of actually sitting down as iwi, kanoi ki te kanoi, and having a marae and tikanga-based approach to cross claims is one that we should be working towards. But how long will it take? You know, that wouldn't be... Well, at least it's driven by iwi. And so what we have at the moment is we've got a process which is driven by the crown. And quite rightly because it's a crown settlement. But iwi being able to sit down with iwi and have these conversations because these are the most difficult ones that we're going to have in these last settlements that are left. Um, just one minute to go, but I just wanna quickly touch on you. The comeback king, Hone Harawira. He's on his comeback campaign. How do you think he performed? He's not the comeback king. I think he's irrelevant, to be honest. He sold his soul to Kim Dotcom. I don't think people will have forgotten that. Kelvin has been a true leader; he's shown grit and determination. And why doesn't Hone front to Kelvin? Why don't they have that debate? No, I don't think Hone's gonna win, and I think what we've seen ` these silly comments about executing people ` I think it's an act of desperation. And we've seen a few comments like that over the last few months. Scott, the voters are being asked to support this Mana kind of relationship, yet Hone doesn't support the Turewhenua. He doesn't look very keen on the Oranga Tamariki bill. Is it realistic? Well, it's realistic that I think it will get through to the election. Absolutely. You know, he was only behind by 700 votes at the last election. So I think it will be tighter than what people think it's going to be. Hone's had to go back, do a mea culpa and go and connect with people up north. People know who Hone is. He's going to use opportunities like this to create some noise. He'll look like an idiot at times, but he'll come out with people going, 'Oh, Hone's back.' Ka pai. Kia ora, tena korua. BOTH: Kia ora. Hei tera wiki i runga i a Te Hui. In the south, rugby reigns supreme. Here in Canterbury, it's part of the culture. But what about racism? I think there's probably more issues out there than what are complained about. We're just tryna be the bigger person, but it's still there. Sometimes it's there in the forefront. Sometimes it's just a little niggle every now and then. It came to the forefront recently when a grandmother was allegedly racially abused by a coach. And it's not a one-off. This is about any form of discrimination, not just racial abuse but other forms of discrimination. We've had cases this year about referees being abused and side-line behaviour. Fights between players. So it's all forms of abuse. Racism isn't unique to rugby or the south, but the Canterbury Rugby Union are making a stand, launching their 'we all bleed red' campaign last month. We all share the same love for this game. I think you've gotta start somewhere, and that's what I think the CRU's doing ` is saying that we need to be actively trying to stop this. If we don't sit there and talk about it between clubs and be able to resolve it between clubs, then no one knows. Otherwise it's just gonna go not so much unpunished but unrecognised. Thanks for joining us today, hui hoppers. We'll post links to the show on our Facebook page and on Twitter at TheHuiNZ. And you'll find all our stories on the Newshub website. Before we go, The Hui team wants to acknowledge the passing of our kaumatua, mentor and friend, television legend Keith Slater. Keith left an indelible mark on New Zealand broadcasting platform, and he certainly left his mark on The Hui. Noreira e te kotuku rerenga tahi o te ao papaoho, haere, okioki, moe mai ra. Kua hikina te hui mo tenei ra. Pai marire ki a taatou katoa. Captions were made with the support of NZ On Air. Copyright Able 2017