Kei nga ihoiho o nga maunga whakahi, kei nga wai whakatere taniwha, nau mai, tahuti mai ki Te Hui. Ko Mihingarangi tenei e mihi atu nei ki a koutou katoa. Welcome to The Hui, Maori current affairs for all New Zealanders. E taro ake nei... Four youth MPs discuss the big issues facing te ao Maori. Hi aha nga rautaki, hi aha ranei to mahere... From Ihumatao to cannabis reform, Te Reo in schools to prisoner voting, our rangatahi share their ideas for our future. Think of it from a Maori perspective. Captions were made with the support of NZ On Air. www.able.co.nz Copyright Able 2019 Karahuihui mai. We often have political panels and debates here on The Hui, hosting both politicians and pundits. But today, we've decided to do something a little different. Last month, Parliament hosted the next generation of aspiring MPs as part of its annual Youth Parliament programme. Today, we've invited four rangatahi who represent four political parties to share their views on a range of issues. They are Labour Party Youth MP Christian Dennison, National Youth MP Te Rina Kotara, New Zealand First Youth MP Maia Berryman-Kamp and Greens Youth MP Pounamu Noviskey Wharehinga. Tena koutou katoa. MPS: Kia ora. Now, before we get into it, let's take a look at our first take ` kia tahuri te aroaro ki te moana o Manukau ki a Ihumatao. The standoff over a housing development at Ihumatao has now entered its fourth week. The contested land is situated close to ancient stone wall gardens, which are the oldest man-made structures in Aotearoa. Ihumatao has become a flashpoint for the lack of protection given to Maori historical sites and the injustice of land confiscations suffered by Maori in the 1800s. The PM has called for the development to be put on hold until a solution is reached. But it comes at a time where rates of Maori homelessness are soaring. So, let's talk Ihumatao. I'll start with you, Te Rina. National Party Leader Simon Bridges is suggesting the army be moved in to get rid of the protectors out at Ihumatao. Do you support this stance? Well... Hard question, I know, to start. (CHUCKLES) Yeah, um... I think, personally, that's a bit of a step too far, taking the army, when they're just protecting their land, and that's their right to protect the land where that's their tupuna, and that's so much culture... Just... Getting the army in ` I reckon that's not really the right way to handle an issue. So you wouldn't go that far? No. OK. So, is this an issue about heritage protection or land confiscation, do you think, Pounamu? (CLEARS THROAT) Um,... I think, personally, it just comes down to culture and a lot of heritage, because, you know, the people belong to the whenua, and the whenua belong to those people. And it's also about being honest about our culture and our history ` that that land was forcefully taken from our people, and to give it back is only right, cos it's not just a building ground. It's not just a land to make it look pretty with your buildings and stuff; it actually has a lot of significance meaning ` significant meaning. ...meaning to it, yeah. To the people, yeah. And some would say, though, that we're in the middle of a housing crisis, and Maori are over-represented when it comes to homelessness. So we've got mana whenua; we've got the protectors; we've got Fletcher Residential; we've got the Council, who changed` rezoned it. Who do you think's the right people, the right group to facilitate the discussions out there? I'd say, because you have... Like, mana whenua of the older generations are very, sort of, focused on 'if this goes through, we just need to mitigate the effects', whereas rangatahi are still like, 'Well, we can protest this. There's a chance to still save our land.' So I feel like, in terms of facilitating the korero, you need someone who would be entirely neutral ` whether it was, like, a whole other entity be created to settle these kind of disputes. Because one of the big problems was it came from legislation; the thing was the Special Housing Act of 2013. So to have the government involved there, even then, you have legal hook-ups. So I think it's just finding whether it's a group or a place where everyone can have their views equally spoken about, yeah. And I guess it's ` where do you start? Which grievance do you start with? Cos, as you say, there was an issue in 2013, '16, and then prior to that, there was the confiscation of land. Let's just bring Christian in here, because you've gone to Parliament to represent Labour, and Maori are calling for the Prime Minister to get out to Ihumatao, to feel the whenua, to be there. Should she go? Yeah, I believe that the Prime Minister should be there. She should visit, and she should see the people she represents. She said at Waitangi that she is a Prime Minister for Maori and that they are a government for Maori, and she said, 'Hold us to account.' And we're holding her to account. And the people at Ihumatao are holding her to account and saying, 'Come see what we're talking about. See what we want. See what we're crying for.' Like, they want to protect their sacred lands, which is their right. And so she should be there and help them fight for their rights. So, you are a registered member of the Labour Party, right? Yep. So has this been an issue for you? As a member? Um, yeah, as I told you before, my badge has temporarily been removed from my school blazer. (CHUCKLES) Yeah, um, I do think it's an issue. For how long? Oh, since the Ihumatao problems have started... So a little private protest for yourself? Um, yeah, and it's just because... I see that, you know, at the moment, we're hearing, 'We're a government for Maori,' and they hold all the Maori seats. They hold all the Maori representation. And the Maori Affairs Select Committee that we sat on at Youth Parliament, they dominate that as well. And I just look at it, and I say, 'If we're gonna say this, are we actually gonna put it into action? Are we actually going to partner with Maori in their communities and help them fight for what they believe is their rights and what I believe is the right of the people at Ihumatao. You raised a really interesting point before, because, um... Well, you did. You said that they should give land back to the people of Ihumatao. But there's a law that prevents that from happening. It was introduced, I think, in the '90s. And so the government can't buy back private land to settle Treaty settlements. Does everyone agree with that? But that's exactly what they've done, though, eh? So... And... No, they've turned it into a state housing area, so that meant that the whanau that had that land for a long time were able to sell it on to Fletcher's. Do you think that's a law that you'd like to see reversed? I think, yeah, it definitely came in, sort of, pro-developer, and it was kind of aimed more towards... being able to, kind of, quell any grievances that tangata whenua might have had. So, I think, to reverse it or to even look at the legislation and say, 'How does it actually work and who really comes out on top with this legislation?' and then go from there. There's another interesting thing that I've picked up in your rangatahi voices, and it's around mana whenua. So, you talk about the older generation of mana whenua. Where do you see rangatahi fitting inside of your iwi structures? Should you have a voice? I would say that, um, like, a lot of... the... the media on Ihumatao is this idea of rangatahi versus kaumatua. And I've thought about it to myself, and it's like` it's a really sad fact, but when we see Maori faces who disagree with each other ` because everyone thinks they know what's best for people ` and they disagree with each other, and they're made to look stupid for having different views, or they're made to look like they don't know what they're doing. But then, when we look to places like Europe, for example, or we look to places where it would be two non-indigenous people having differing views, it's glorious, or it's people fighting for their rights. And I would say that, yeah, it's all right for people to have differing views, and in this case, the loudest rangatahi voice is for Ihumatao to be protected. Just quickly, with you, Te Rina, you said, 'Don't send in the army,' but should there be an end point? A week? Month? Year? Yeah. It would be good to have a point where, OK, you have to... not confess, but, like, show up to all your negotiations and then,... Mm. ...like, just set dates just to get it moving, cos just protesting and then not having dates will just prolong everything, and that's not good. We want a solution. Ka pai. OK, after the break ` should Te Reo Maori be compulsory in schools, and should New Zealand history be part of the curriculum? Our Youth MPs share their views next. Auraki mai ano ki Te Hui. Kei te matapaki hia nga take nui o te wa e nga mema paremata rangatahi heoi ano kia tahuri ake tatou ki te kaupapa tuarua. The call for compulsory teaching of Te Reo Maori in schools continues to divide political thinking. While the Greens are staunch supporters of the idea, Labour's policy focuses on normalisation, while National and New Zealand First support making it available for those who wish to learn but oppose compulsion. Meanwhile, a petition by the Association for History Teachers has called upon the government to make the teaching of New Zealand history compulsory in our schools. So should these subjects be compulsory learning or not? Ae. E tautoko ana koe ki a whakaako he Te Reo Maori ki nga kura kato i te motu? (SPEAKS MAORI) Ae. (SPEAKS MAORI) (SPEAKS MAORI) He tangata Maori tenei no reira he whakamana hoki i... nga tangata tuturu o tenei, o tenei whenua. (SPEAKS MAORI) (SPEAKS MAORI) (SPEAKS MAORI) (SPEAKS MAORI) (SPEAKS MAORI) (SPEAKS MAORI) Maia, Pounamu's saying Te Reo Maori and history should be taught so we all know where we came from and all of our stories. You know, two people signed the Treaty of Waitangi. I don't think New Zealand First supports compulsory Te Reo in the schools. Why shouldn't New Zealanders learn both languages? I think, if you're talking in terms of 'shouldn't'... shouldn't learn both languages, you do have to take into account that people might not necessarily stay in New Zealand once they finish their education, so it could be, like, you could learn another language that's more important. But then, on a more personal thing, I think our curriculum is kind of based on` it said it's based on the Treaty of Waitangi, which is inherently Euro-centric. So I think both parties signed ` the Maori and Pakeha ` but we do see more of the Pakeha. So, yeah, I think New Zealand First is thinking more in terms of, practical and realistically ` is it an important skill to have when you're looking into jobs in the future? But personally, I'd say that employers will look favourably on you if you have Te Reo Maori. And I think a knowledge of korero and hitori Maori is going to be important to understand, like, why the foundations of New Zealand are the way they are, and why the injustices Maori face are so prominent and where they came from. Is it all about getting a job, though, learning Te Reo? You know, what is important about Te Reo Maori, do you think? Um, I reckon it's important to learn Te Reo Maori due to just how much suppression that we've had in the past, and because of the Treaty of Waitangi, it's our duty as New Zealanders going forward into the future to protect this language and to just keep on growing it and making it just a part of New Zealand, rather than 'oh, yeah, there's Te Reo Maori, and then there's New Zealand' but rather bringing it together to make us all, you know... Let's just talk about what Pounamu was talking about, and talking about, say, the New Zealand Wars and things like that. Should it be, say, for example, compulsory in year nine that all students in social studies learn something about Taranaki Wars or the Waikato Wars? So, this is something we actually talked about on the Maori Affairs Select Committee, with Pounamu, and I'm really pushing my MP who I represent at the Ministry of Education,... Chris Hipkins. ...Chris Hipkins, yeah. And we're saying` I pushed him too. Yeah. 'We'. Yeah, yeah. And so one of my big things is ` racism comes from ignorance, and ignorance comes from either lack of education or miseducation. And so I will go` I went into my Level 1 last year` I went into my year 11 English class and heard some boys say, 'Oh, there were never any wars in New Zealand.' And I said, 'Yes, there were. 'My family were deprived. Our land was taken because of those wars.' And if we made it compulsory to teach our own history ` because you could ask that same kid about the timeline of the American Civil Rights ` there would be so much more understanding, so much more empathy. And so when we have these people in the Facebook comments saying, 'Oh, Maori just want more money from the Treaty of Waitangi,' 'Maori just want to bludge off the government...' You think it will help people understand that, actually, what was the... Reparations. ...what was the stuff, what was the past of those things. What about the fact that you can't really find the New Zealand Wars places? You know, there's not a lot of signposting. Do you think it's the responsibility of the government to point those out and to show people them? I think, then, obviously, when you have accessibility to sites when those sites are protected, you will... like, people will interact with them more, rather than having to search out their own. And even then, you could bring that back into Ihumatao, which is` like, that's a historical site. Similar issue, isn't it? It isn't necessarily to do with New Zealand Wars, but it's... it's the significance of Maori agriculture and our history. So I think there is almost a duty to protect the history, because it's our own, and we have quite a unique opportunity to be able to go out and actually visit the sites and see where the history happened, instead of reading. So, there's quite a few memorials and commemorations and statues to Pakeha in our history ` not a lot to some of our rangatira Maori. What do you think we should do with some of those statues? For example, in Otahuhu, there's Marmaduke Dixon, who was part of the colonial troops that invaded and confiscated land in Waikato. Do we leave it there? Or do we take them down? Uh, we can't just, like, ignore our history, that 'oh, this bit didn't happen', and we can't just say, 'Oh, yeah, we should just take it down, cos it's considered bad.' But rather we should just correctly represent it and not... POUNAMU: Kia ora. ...'Oh, well, this is my opinion of this thing, so it's gonna be that way.' But, like, rather than supporting it with, 'Well, what was the Maori perspective at that time and then at this time?' E tautoko ana koe? Yeah, so, even with the Maori Select Committee ` like Christian was talking about ` in our report, one of the girls who submitted to us, even she talked about that. It's not about removing the statues, because, you know, we're interrelations, Maori and Pakeha. Pakeha can acknowledge and commemorate... their tangata any way they want, cos, you know, we have marae. We have tekoteko that represent our tipuna and our rangatira and our tangata, but it's actually just about being honest. Like, if you look at the Cook statue, it says he's this brilliant navigator, he's this brilliant person ` and he also came here, killed our people, took our land, all that kind of` etc. Yeah. And... on that. Sorry, really quickly ` Um, and it's like, yeah, yeah, we have all these memorials to Captain Cook, for example. And for places like Ihumatao, one thing that we brought up ` if these Maori places ` like Ihumatao, one of the original landing spots for Maori ` if they were where Captain Cook originally landed, would they be recognised? Matai pai tera. Kia mau tonu mai ra te titiro. We'll be back with more after the break. Kei te matakitaki koutou i a Te Hui, where four of our Maori Youth MPs are discussing some of the big take facing Te Ao Maori. They are Labour's Christian Dennison, National's Te Rina Kotara, New Zealand First's Maia Berryman-Kamp and the Greens' Pounamu Noviskey Wharehinga. Let's hear what they have to say about our next kaupapa. Next year, New Zealanders will have the opportunity to vote in a binding referendum on whether or not to change the laws governing the personal use of cannabis. In a poll The Hui commissioned earlier this year, 75% of Maori correspondents said they would vote in favour of legislation for personal use. While a change may decrease the number of Maori coming into the criminal justice system, critics say it could contribute to a rise in mental health illnesses such as depression and schizophrenia. So, what do we think? Should we decriminalise marijuana? Not sure? (CHUCKLES) I would say that as long as we're protecting our rangatahi, as you say ` as it was said ` from mental health issues. Under-25 rangatahi are really vulnerable, and especially Maori. Whatever we do ` making sure that we protect them for the future of our country. So, you can drive a car at 16; you can go to the pub at 18. If we do decriminalise... cannabis, what age do you think it should be? I think, because it's a drug, and alcohol's also a drug, I think any regulations you have on alcohol you should also mirror with cannabis. So I'd say 18 would be the age. Just quickly, before we move on to the most pressing issues ` do you think that prisoners should vote? That's something that's been talked about recently. Should prisoners be able to vote while they're in jail? Um... Interestingly, yes. I don't know much about that, and I actually haven't heard much about it. But just thinking, you know, if I had whanau who were put away, and they were doing good, and they had whanau out here living, you know, they'd wanna have a say in how their kids are being brought up, how their community is being brought up, how their people are being brought up. And, um, having that right environment and having that say, it actually really really matters. And, um, with Maori not voting so much, the Maori in prison, you know, if they had a voice, maybe that will increase the numbers. Would you support that, Te Rina? Yeah, I would support it, cos there's no real danger in a prisoner voting to society. That's, like, why they are in prison for the first place. But also, giving them the vote would also, kind of` when they get out of prison, it will also... More engaged? Yeah, more engaged in how they have their part. OK, let's move on to the most pressing issue for you. If you were to become a politician, what would you` what would be the most pressing issue for you? Um, I would definitely make New Zealand history compulsory in school. As I said before, it is our responsibility to learn about our past. And again, I say 'New Zealand history'. It's not just Maori history; it's New Zealand history ` so that we can move forward and we can understand each other and have empathy for each other and move forward in a way that is better and more positive for the future of Aotearoa. Yeah. Te Rina? The biggest issue you think is facing us? Facing us today? Just keeping the Treaty in mind and that we've got a duty to not only New Zealanders but to Maori alike, and I reckon that does start with being honest and... making Te Reo Maori compulsory in schools. Ka pai. And Maia? I'd say the biggest is probably the climate crisis and how it's impacting not only Maori and all of New Zealand but also our Pasifika brothers and sisters, and just taking, as a country, a harder stance on where we think` and also because so many of our industries rely on the whenua. How would you balance economy versus environment? I think, in that, you would have to start thinking short-term/long-term investments, because if we can be, as a country, a leader in sustainability, other countries will jump on. We don't necessarily have to make a big step, but we can encourage others. And then technologies or inventions that we create, we could then mark it off in saying, 'This is a new step in sustainability.' So I think it's finding opportunities to be economically viable while also not prioritising profit. Ka pai. Kia ora. Pounamu? Uh, for me, it's definitely Maori history, and that also links back to Ihumatao being a huge thing, cos I think that, like Te Rina and Christian said, it's about being honest. If we wanna move together as a nation, we have to be honest. And it's also acknowledging the Treaty of Waitangi, which comes back to Ihumatao. You know, this... this kaupapa and the way it will turn out will determine how every other whenua and how every other kaupapa, like Ihumatao now, will turn out for the rest of us. Cos it's not just Ihumatao. There's Te Toka-a-Taiau. You know, there's Mauna Kea. There's so much, and, yeah, that's the biggest one for me. Ka pai. And just before we go to something very special, who of you thinks we should fly the tino rangatiratanga flag at Parliament? Yo! (CHUCKLES) I think it would be pretty cool. Yes from Pounamu. Christian? It would be pretty cool. Would you support that, having two flags at Parliament? Yeah, I would. Yeah, I think, to represent the dual heritage and sort of have the government saying, 'Maori are here; we support.' Ka pai. Well, Ms Pounamu is going to give us a wai next, but first, let's take a look at what's coming up next week. She's the rising star of comedy in Aotearoa. Yeah, I am Kura of the 'Shoulda Woulda', and this show is all about me. It's about my insides, my outsides, my backside, my left side, my strong side, my offside ` bit of a rugby joke there, very good. Kura Forrester crowned this year's Billy T James comedian of the year. ON PHONE: And the 2019 Billy T award winner is... Still makes me feel nervous. ...Kura Forrester! (CHEERING, APPLAUSE) We check out her new stand-up ` 'Kura, Shoulda, Woulda' ` and take a look behind the laughter. I feel like, for the last two, three years, I've been managing to work as an actor and a writer and a comedian full-time, and that's really nice to be able to pay the bills with that sort of work, cos it's been a long time comin', man. Kua hikina te hui mo tenei ra. To close our show, we leave you with a special performance by Pounamu Noviskey Wharehinga, a.k.a. Miss Pou. Anei a 'Ka Taka Te Po'. Noho ora mai. (PLAYS GUITAR CHORDS) # Ka taka te po. # Ka whiti te ra. # Ka mahara # ke hi toko ringa. (SINGS IN MAORI) # Hoki atu ra # ki te po # kerekere. # He ranginui # manaaki ti a mai ra. (CONTINUES SINGING IN MAORI) (PLAYS GUITAR, SINGS IN MAORI) # He aroha. # He aroha. # He aroha. (CONTINUES SINGING IN MAORI) (CONTINUES SINGING IN MAORI) (CONTINUES SINGING IN MAORI) # He aroha. # He aroha. # He aroha. # He aroha. www.able.co.nz Copyright Able 2019 # Ka taka te po. # ALL: He mea tautoko na Te Mangai Paho. The Hui is made with support from NZ On Air.