Haere ra, e tama. Mou te tai ata, moku te tai po. Josiah ko te aroha pumau toho haere. Ko Mihingarangi tenei, e tangi atu nei, e mihi atu nei. Welcome to The Hui ` Maori current affairs for all New Zealanders. E taro ake nei... The government is taking urgent action to rebuild our economy post-COVID-19, fast-tracking new developments by circumventing the RMA. Using the RMA takes too long, costs too much and hasn't properly protected the environment. But what does it mean for iwi who are already being bulldozed by developers? Sometimes, on our resource consents list, we can get up to 250 consents every other week. A lot of our sites are being destroyed every day. And what might the cost be for their mokopuna? You've got the future generations' identity at risk, and the heritage that goes along with that identity. And National burns its bridges. Simon is out, and Todd Muller is in. We sift through the ashes. Captions were made with the support of NZ On Air. www.able.co.nz Copyright Able 2020 Karahuihui mai. The Resource Management Act, or the RMA, is the country's main piece of environmental legislation. It offers protection for Maori cultural heritage and rights under the principles of the Treaty of Waitangi. But in the face of COVID-19, the government wants to bypass the RMA for two years to allow roading, infrastructure and housing projects to be fast-tracked. It's being touted as the way to restart our flagging economy. South Auckland iwi Ngati Te Ata played a vital role in the foundation of Maori rights within the RMA. But what impact will a fast-tracked consents process have for Maori? Anei te purongo a John Boynton. JOHN BOYNTON: The government is looking to rebuild our economy after the crippling impacts of COVID-19. I know that our success in controlling the virus has come at a price. It wants to create jobs by fast-tracking hundreds of shovel-ready projects through bypassing the Resource Management Act. Ngati Te Ata is at the centre of South Auckland's most intense housing development. Sometimes, on our resource consents list, we can get up to 200, 250 consents every other week. But what does bypassing the Resource Management Act mean for them... A lot of our sites are being destroyed every day, and that's every day. ...and for other iwi wanting to ensure their whenua is protected? You've got the future generations' identity at risk and the heritage that goes along with that identity. (CONTEMPLATIVE ELECTRONIC MUSIC) Pukekauri Pa looks out to the mouth of the Waikato River and is one of a number of sacred Ngati Te Ata pa sites. The terraced hillsides are the only visible reminders of the past ` a past Roimata Minhinnick is steeped in. You know, the mind jumps back a couple of hundred years, and you start imagining what it must have been like for our tupuna ` the beauty that they had in their time and then the challenges that they went through as well. For Ngati Te Ata, the preservation of its history and environment has been a constant battle. Roimata's mother, the late Dame Nganeko Minhinnick, was an environmental champion who fought for the law to recognise kaitiakitanga values. Her people had 47,000 acres of their land confiscated by the Crown after the Waikato Land Wars in 1863. Over the next century, the iwi was forced to watch the destruction of their traditional pa and the pollution of their waterways. This would lead Dame Nganeko to take the landmark Manukau Claim to the Waitangi Tribunal. So, the pollution of the harbour was a biggie that came from the Manukau Claim, as well as the desecration of the burial grounds at Maioro. The attitudes of decision makers ` you know, there was a range of issues that came from there from which these types of principles evolved and eventually became embedded into the RMA. Thanks to Dame Nganeko, concepts like kaitiakitanga are now enshrined in our environmental law through the Resource Management Act. It requires local authorities to consult with mana whenua over proposed developments within their rohe. Edith Tuhimata is the Ngati Te Ata consents manager. She says Dame Nganeko was a groundbreaker. She set the foundations for the kaitiaki that are in their roles today. She set that portion of the RMA which is those that have powers must take into account our relationship with our ancestral lands, our taonga, our wahi tapu and water. Edith now oversees hundreds of new resource consents every week and is already overwhelmed with the workload. How big of a role is that? It's a huge job, especially considering how intensification of development is happening, especially in the South Auckland area, which is our area. Engaging with developers, engaging with Auckland Council, with the CCOs of Auckland Council, like Watercare, Healthy Waters, their parks and reserve services. Over the last year, the Minister for the Environment, David Parker, has signalled his intentions for a comprehensive overhaul of the RMA. Using the RMA takes too long, costs too much and hasn't properly protected the environment. But Edith says part of the reason the process is slow is because some iwi aren't resourced to keep up with the escalating demand. I think, you know, being a kaitiaki, you're executive-level, you know, but you don't get executive wages. You're on the lowest scale of wages. So, you know, those sort of areas there need to be looked at. Making sure that, if we're out there doing this work, that there's funding provided for us to actually do a really good job. And now Dame Nganeko's legacy could be bulldozed into the dust. With COVID-19 crippling the economy, the government wants to enact new legislation bypassing the RMA so it can fast-track shovel-ready projects. But Roimata says rebooting the economy shouldn't come at the expense of iwi rights and cultural heritage. It's not like Maori are opposed to development. We want to employ our people. But how do you do that and respect the heritage and the culture and the traditions as well? And the only way you can do that is by having a relationship. And if you deny the relationship and avoid... the partnership, then don't be surprised if you do end up in court. There's already concern over the increasing housing development happening in the Franklin area ` its rich and fertile soil a food bowl for the region. This is just the tip of the iceberg about the actual development that's happening in the South Auckland area itself, and we're struggling to keep up with it now. And so if they fast-track this stuff, then what will happen to our cultural heritage that lies in this area, you know? For Ngati Te Ata, protecting their cultural heritage is a key part of being kaitiaki. Waiuku kaumatua George Flavell works to preserve pa sites. His mahi includes archiving ancient tools, gardens and archaeology. I do it because I believe in our Ranginui and Papatuanuku,... looking after the... skyways and the whenua and all the rivers and everything that goes with it. George is carving a pou which will mark one of 60 recorded pa sites in the area. When you see these pas, you see all their mara, their gardens, how they divided each whanau with a garden plot ` it's come down through the ages. Many of the pa are on private farmland, but George works closely with landowners to preserve them. He says every day, pa sites like these are being destroyed through development. We can hardly keep up with the infrastructure now, so what's gonna happen with all this growth? The economy is sort of slipping there a bit. And so maybe things can be looked in a different way there. But with our... wahi tapu, it's a different matter altogether. Roimata Minhinnick is concerned by the lack of detail around how wahi tapu will be protected in the fast-tracked consents process. Does this current decision feel like it's a step backwards? I think we've got more questions than anything at this point. And there's a lot we don't know. What we understand is that big projects will be fast-tracked. So we've got definite concerns about that, right? So will we be able to participate? How can we innovate our way forward and look at the issues, case by case? For that opportunity to be taken away,... Hmm. ...I think it lacks foresight. This is one of the pou George Flavell carved at Mahanihani at the Manukau Heads. The pakeke of Ngati Te Ata continue to carry out Dame Nganeko's vision, inspiring the next generation of kaitiaki. We're an extremely waimarie ` lucky ` iwi that we've got some really beautiful, intelligent people, especially when it comes to the cultural heritage and that. And it enables us to try and put together a package to have a succession plan for our young people. And like many iwi around the country, Ngati Te Ata will be keeping an eye on how the government moves forward in its plans to fast-track development. I'll be interested to see how it goes into the future. We try our hardest to maintain our integrity and our mana. Sometimes, we're not always able to do that, but we try our best as kaitiaki to do that. Nga John Boynton tera ripoata. We hope to speak to Minister David Parker in the not-too-distant future. Next, we head out to Ihumatao to discuss Fletcher's decision to lay off a thousand kaimahi. Auraki mai ano. The repossession of a disputed land block in South Auckland was one of the biggest news stories of 2019. But like most issues, Ihumatao has been eclipsed by the COVID-19 pandemic. This week, it was revealed that the owners of the proposed development, Fletcher's Construction, plan to lay off 1000 New Zealand workers. This despite receiving nearly $70 million in wage subsidies from the New Zealand taxpayer and recording a profit of $259 million last year. I headed out to Ihumatao to speak to Pania Newton, spokesperson for Save Our Unique Landscapes, about her thoughts on the latest developments. (GENTLE GUITAR MUSIC) Late last year, Fletcher's were looking for $40 million in order to return this whenua. That's twice what they paid. And now we know that they've received $67 million in wage subsidies, and they're actually going to look to release 1000 people from their jobs. What's your whakaaro about that? I think I was initially quite sad to hear that Fletcher's were looking to relieve 1000 workers across Aotearoa, and my heart really goes to all the kaimahi who are impacted by this change. The way in which the wage subsidy and the employee relief has rolled out, in my view, is somewhat unjust. For me, it really goes to the heart of the company and their ethos around what they prioritise, and it showed that they prioritise capital gain over people. What's your whakaaro around what they should do with this whenua? They should show some goodwill to the New Zealand public and to Aotearoa in allowing this whenua to be gifted back to the people to hold in trust for all New Zealanders to enjoy. You know, they've, in the last few years, reported huge amounts of profits, and so I think that they should be adequately providing for those employees who are being relieved and do some goodwill and return the whenua at no cost. The government's looking to introduce new legislation which will sideline the RMA in order to start these shovel-ready projects. Do you have concern around the new proposal? I think we should be concerned about how this could potentially impact whenua Maori and wahi tapu and our environment. I think that they need to give great consideration to Te Tiriti o Waitangi, He Whakaputanga and the Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples. I think the government aren't careful, then they could potentially, in the future, face similar events to those which we saw here at Ihumatao in July last year. I'm also concerned about how Maori are going to be included in the decision-making process, and I think that this could furthermore marginalise Maori. When you say that they could potentially face something like we saw here in July last year, is that because of the way that the land has been re-zoned? This proposed law change and how it will... exclude public consultation is similar to that which we saw in the Special Housing Areas Accord Act, which gave permission to Fletcher's to proceed with their multimillion-dollar housing project here at Ihumatao. Had we been included in the discussions, I think that the events that we saw in July last year could have potentially not have happened, so my concern is if Maori are not adequately included in the decision-making process, or our... values are not taken into consideration, then the government could potentially face more events to that which we saw at Ihumatao last year. The government prides itself on being a good Treaty partner. In order to be a good Treaty partner, what's your message to them? Um, I wouldn't agree that this government is a better Treaty partner than any other government. It is still a colonial establishment. But if they truly want to be a better Treaty partner, then they must honour Te Tiriti o Waitangi as it was intended in 1840, and they must share the power dynamics. Kia mau tonu mai ra te titiro. We discuss National's new leadership line-up. That's next. You're watching The Hui. Well, it's been a fiery week in politics with Simon Bridges' hopes of leading the National Party into the next election up in smoke. That's after a Newshub Poll showed support for him and the Nats had collapsed. On Thursday, both Bridges and his deputy, Paula Bennett, were rolled and replaced by political dark horse Todd Muller and Auckland Central MP Nikki Kaye. While the pair may not be household names yet, it's fair to say he's a little bit country and she's a little bit rock & roll. We asked Mr Muller to appear on the show today, and he turned us down. But here instead is the former national MP the Honourable Tau Henare and Kawerau's star commentator Shane Te Pou. Tena korua. Kia ora. Kia ora. Thank you for taking up our offer. Is it fair to say that's a good description of this new leadership? Yeah. I think it's a good description. You know, the afterglow of recently being elected as the leader will give him some benefit. Whether he can do it long-term... He's a rather indistinguishable chap, you know? Looks a bit like my friend sitting to the right of me. Come on, bro. So we'll just how he go` We'll just see how he goes. Quite a dynamic duo, and I think what we may well see for the first time in a long time in New Zealand is a sort of co-leadership with him and Nikki. Do you think they've got the goods to get them over the line come this next election? No. (CHUCKLES) Will they do better than the current...? I think, um... It's an uphill battle... to be... to unseat Jacinda where she is at the moment. And I'm talking about Jacinda. I'm not talking about the Labour Party, and I think they are two different things. We've had eight or nine weeks of wall-to-wall Jacinda. It's all been PR and everything, and it's worked. It's worked for her, and that's shown in the polls. Is it a mismatch, you know, to have him up against Jacinda? Nah, nah. Look, if you wanted a nice-looking person, you wouldn't pick Todd. You know, he looks like a farmer. He's... Like the bro says, he's indistinguishable. He's got skills, but you know what I like about him? He's authentic, or he seems authentic. And I think too much has, in the past 12 months, maybe, two years, has been put on PR, on 'what I'm trying to be like' instead of 'what you really are like'. And I think people are wanting authenticity. Tau's right. I think he is authentic. I think he does have empathy. I think he's also comfortable in his own skin, and Simon wasn't. You know, I met Simon on several occasions. You always got the view that he always wanted to be somewhere else. And that connect is very important, and it would be a good contrast in terms of what Jacinda Ardern delivers. What about reconnecting with Winston, the Maori Party? You know, up until now, it hasn't really looked hopeful for the Maori Party to have any kind of relationship with National. Could this all change? Yeah, I think... I think that there's even talk that now that Simon and Paula have been removed` And they were the two big hurdles to Winston sitting down and even having a yarn with them, let alone talking about the future. So, uh,... Todd and Nikki have that ability. They're not, uh... They're not soiled by what has gone on before. And I think Winston will be open to just having a yarn with them, not so much about a coalition. I mean, let's not forget, Winston has to get back. And currently, based on those polls, he's not coming back. Although, many of us have said that before, and he has come back. But the Greens are in an invidious position as well. And neither is the Maori Party. But in the past, you know, under Sir John Key ` he'd reached out to the Maori Party, even helping them campaign at some point. Is that a possibility? Well, possibly, but I think the Maori Party ain't gonna be back in Parliament. I don't see that they've got the organisation. I don't see that there's the issue that will drive them forward. I think that he will have a discussion with Winston, and I think he will reach out in a very clever way. I would imagine one of the first policy decisions that he will make is to move the port to Northland. You both have been involved in elections. Is campaigning going to be more difficult under COVID-19 restrictions? Yeah, I think it will. Like Shane was saying earlier... Who will win from it? Oh, well, it's hard, you know? You've gotta organise your hoardings. You've gotta organise your fundraising. You've gotta organise some public meetings. Town halls... 10 people 2m apart, you know? I mean, all that sort of` We can't even hold a tangi, for goodness' sake. Mm. The big parties will benefit from it, because they've got the organisation. They've already got the money in the bank. They've also got quite good grassroots campaigns through their LECs or whatever the National Party get. So they will be the benefactors of this. We had a couple of stories earlier on the RMA. I just wanted to raise something. Waikato-Tainui's talking... appealing, actually, to Auckland to say, 'Hey, stop using the wai, the water in our awa, 'because it's under pressure, and it's not doing so well.' What are your thoughts around that? Have we mismanaged our water up here? Oh, personally, I think... not only up here. I think throughout the country, we've mismanaged our water. We bottle it. We give it to the Chinese, and the Chinese sell it at a high price, and we don't make anything out of it. You know, I think we need to take a really serious look at our water management ` and ownership as well, because the Maori... there is the Maori case in there, all wrapped up in the ownership. So I hear what Tainui are saying. I hear what Waikato-Tainui are saying, but it actually goes deeper than just the Waikato River. Mm. But as co-owners, or co-kaitiaki ` co-guardians, I think it is ` you know, do they have a right to`? Oh, I think so, but also, there was a $500 million, half a billion bucks given to that settlement on the basis that they would feed water to Aucklanders, so I think we have to take that into consideration. Yeah, we have mismanaged water. And also, it's a hot political issue. We were meant to have freshwater policy come out. That ain't gonna come out any time soon. But isn't it Watercare's responsibility to make sure that we've got enough here? Yeah, there is Watercare, but we don't have really good catchment facilities in and around Auckland, and I think we have to provide better. But what we have is Watercare looking after their own backsides and not allowing... It's amazing, that not allowing the ability for the punter, for the ratepayer, to actually get water off their roof for the gardens or for the toilet or whatever. So our management of... even wastewater. We have plenty of water. We just flush it all away, and it goes out to sea. What we don't have is good catchment and management facilities. Ka pai. I'm gonna go off-script here, because before we go, I just want to mihi up our EP, our manu iti from Arahura Pa. Our executive producer last night swept up the Executive Editor of the Year at the Voyager Awards. She is a true pioneer of Maori television ` relentless, unshakeable. She'll fight the fights that no one else will, and she'll do it with empathy, aroha and compassion. Nau mai matauranga engari mohio whakahakune ana. Tena koe, e te rangatira. Drum roll. Pakipaki. Courageous! Thank you. That's why I've brought these two. You know, what's amazing is that her, you and the team ` where you've come from. You got the boot from Maori Affairs` uh, Maori TV. You got the boot from Native Affairs. They cut that off. And where are you now? We're all used to getting the boot at this table. Yes! Tena koe. Tena tatou. Kia ora. Coming up next week... MALE VOCALIST: # Swing low. GROUP: # Swing low. RUWANI PERERA: When the city came to a standstill, those who call the streets their home came inside. It's a big help for me to get back on my feet. For those of us that have been working with homelessness for a long time, it's kinda like a dream come true. Who could've imagined that a potentially deadly virus could be a possible cure for chronic homelessness? Having a place like this ` it's a true blessing, eh. I was grateful. I was overly grateful. It's the Ritz to me, this place. And as tourist numbers tumble, the door is open to new possibilities. That pipeline of housing is really opening, so it's really exciting. These are our people. Being in this position to help them, it's been really important to us. Kua hikina Te Hui mo tenei ra. To celebrate New Zealand Music Month, we leave you this morning with a new te reo Maori single by Maaka. Anei a karanga. Noho ora mai ra. # Kawea, # hikina, # tukuna, # te aroha. # Te manuka, # te totara. # E te Atua, # ihoa, # tukuna # to wairua. # Mo nga ra o toku ao. # Nga ra o toku ao. # Karangatia ra. # Karangatia ra. # Kia mama, te aroha. # Karangatia ra. # Karangatia ra. # Kia mama, # te aroha. # Whakato, # te kakano, # te kakano o te manako. # Me hapaitia, # me karakia. # E te Atua, # ihoa, # tukuna # to wairua. # Mo nga ra o toku ao. # Nga ra o toku ao. # Karangatia ra. # Karangatia ra. # Kia mama, te aroha. # Karangatia ra. # Karangatia ra. # Kia mama, te aroha. (RELAXED GUITAR OUTRO) Captions were made with the support of NZ On Air. www.able.co.nz Copyright Able 2020 ALL: He mea tautoko na Te Mangai Paho. The Hui is made with support from NZ On Air.