Ko Mihingarangi tenei e mihi atu nei ki a koutou katoa. Welcome to The Hui ` Maori current affairs for all New Zealanders. E taro ake nei ` Dallas Adams is Aotearoa's most capped F45 member. - It wasn't even my goal, to be honest. I think that just came with it being so passionate. - He shares how his passion helped him to overcome sexual abuse and drug and alcohol dependency. - I wanted to start rebuilding the foundations that I didn't know I had. They help me stay consistent. They help me go through all the pain. - We were just really proud of the fact that it's someone from our studio, and we're blessed that it's Dallas, our member number one, who's leading the way in that regard. - Then we speak to National's Dr Shane Reti about the Maori Health Authority, Three Waters and co-governance. www.able.co.nz Copyright Able 2022 Tahuti mai. Tama tu, tama ora, tama noho, tama mate. He's Aotearoa's most capped F45 member, a poster boy for physical strength and fitness. But it's Dallas Adams' inner strength that defines his identity. Dallas is a survivor of sexual abuse and decades of drug and alcohol dependency. Now the 37-year-old is sharing his story in the hope it can help others. Kei a D'Angelo Martin te roranga ake o nga korero. - At the break of dawn, you'll find Dallas Rahui Te Ahuru Adams here. - Training's helped me in so many ways. - Working the body... - I didn't do this to look good on the outside. I did this to feel good on the inside. - ...strengthening a once-broken spirit. - Good work, Dallas. - Exercising the trauma of his past to become the most capped F45 member in the country. - I knew I had to be that person to bring some light in that darkness. - When the F45 fitness craze started in the Hawkes Bay four years ago, 37-year-old Dallas Adams was the first to sign up. - F45 has really been a blessing. Huge blessing. If this wasn't here, I wouldn't be where I am today. - And where he is today is a long way from the pain of his past. - So this place here was where I spent most of my childhood. - It's a story that begins here in Camberly ` Hastings, where he grew up. - Didn't have a backyard in our home, so this was it. Brings a lot of good memories, hanging out with all the other kids, doing what children should be still doing is getting amongst the nature, even if they're in a` in a place of hardship. - And hardship was very much a part of life for Dallas. When he was just 5 years old, he started to be sexually abused by trusted adults. Where are we, Dallas? - We're outside the very house that, uh... when I first encountered my... sexual abuse. - How did it start? - I was asleep. Yeah, I was asleep in one of the bedrooms. Woke up to... to being... being molested, being... just being... Yeah, just being abused, bro. - Mum and Dad dropped you off here? - Yeah, bro. They didn't know. - Yeah. Dallas says he was so young at the time, he thought the abuse was normal. When he reached 10 years of age, he realised what was happening to him wasn't OK. The abuse ended, and a few years later, he worked up the courage to tell his whanau. - They were shocked. They were all shocked. And that was them being angry about it. Disappointed, but... they didn't know. So... I don't blame them. - While the abuse had stopped, the pain hadn't. - That set me up to just pretty much rebel. Yeah, just hated everyone, hated everything. Wasn't happy. You know, waking up To go through all of that as a young Maori male, everything's stacked against you ` all the odds. And yeah, it just` Yeah, it's not a` It's not a feeling I want anyone to go through. - To cope with his mamae, Dallas turned to drugs and alcohol. - To me, that was medicine. To me, when I was picking up the bottle, it was comfort. It was, to me, safety. It was... just really numbing that pain and getting through the day. I was drinking a lot, heaps. And then yeah, the drugs followed after that, not long after that. - What started as recreational use spiralled into 20 years of substance abuse. - I thought that was the way to feel good, to feel better. Not knowing that that's only for a moment in time. And then after that, that's when the crash starts to happen and the withdrawals, and the trauma starts to come back again. - Clawing his way back from two decades of abuse and addiction wouldn't be easy. It would take a spiritual awakening. - Came at a crossroads. At the time, I was real lost, you know? Drunk and drugged up and... just walking the streets, just feeling lost as. And then... I just looked up, eh? Looked up into the sky, cos we all believe in something. (EXHALES HEAVILY) For me, it was like, 'Oh, if there's a God out there, can you just tell me? 'Can you, like, make me feel better?' There was the moment where I felt that genuine aroha ` that genuine love. (UPLIFTING MUSIC) - Next ` blood, sweat and tears. Dallas tells us how he transformed his life and how he was able to forgive his abusers. - I knew I had to forgive, and it wasn't about taking my power away. It was more about letting it go. E taro ake nei ` sent him spiralling into 20 years of drug and alcohol addiction. In this next part, Dallas tells The Hui how he was able to transform from a broken man into Aotearoa's most capped F45 member who is now helping others to transform their lives. Kaua ma te waewae tutuki, engari ma upoko pakaru. Kei a D'Angelo Martin nga whakamahuki. - TRAINER: All right, we turned up this morning to get something out of it! - When Dallas Adams says exercise saved his life, he means it. - Let's finish strong, team! - It's helped keep this sexual abuse survivor clean and sober after two decades of drug and alcohol abuse. - Win the morning; win the day. - These days, Dallas is a fitness fanatic. I've joined him at the gym, hoping to keep up. But actually struggling quite a bit. What made you come to F45? - I've tried several other gyms, you know. And then it wasn't really happening, because I didn't know I needed that extra support at the start, and there wasn't really any group classes or anything like that at the time. - But since joining this F45 club four years ago, Dallas found the tautoko he needed and dropped over 20kg in the process. - I wanted to start rebuilding the foundations that I didn't know I had. They help me stay consistent; they help me go through all the pain. But that pain is a reaction of becoming a better person or being stronger or being mentally well. - 1400 classes on, he's the most capped F45 member in Aotearoa. - It wasn't even my goal, to be honest. I think that just came with it ` being so passionate. This place brought passion. This place brought that fire within me. - We were just really proud of the fact that, you know, someone from our studio, and, you know, we're blessed that it's Dallas, our member number one, who's is leading the way in that regard. - Ryan Tongia, owner and coach of F45 Hastings, is an eyewitness to Dallas' growth as a person. - The man that you see today with Mr Dallas Adams is definitely a... far better version than what he was four years ago. I still remember the first time I called him up to, you know, welcome him into the F45 whanau. He did come across, as, you know, having a quiet demeanour. - Once Ryan became aware of Dallas' past trauma, he and the rest of the F45 members wrapped around him. - If we were going to be able to help him with his journey, we needed the whole team involved. - That journey has taken Dallas all the way to Asia, where, in 2018, he completed the Great Wall of China Marathon. - That's it. We're gonna speed it up now. - And today, he's putting me through my paces. - That's it. Five seconds. Three, two, one! That is us for your Thursday workout. - Far, that was actually quite intense, bro. What a way to start the day. I can see why it's so addicting. - It is very addicting. But it's a positive addiction. You know, it sets me up for mahi. - Dallas now works as a health coach at Health Hawke's Bay, helping others to make positive change in their lives. He says a key component of his mahi is encouraging tane Maori to open up about their challenges. - Just struggling with the motivation. - They're in their vulnerable stage. And it's about gaining their trust from the get go. You have to be genuine in this role and in helping others. We have to have that image of being the tough guy, 'get over it' kind of thing. But now it's like, 'No, no, you're more of a man talking about some genuine feelings.' - For Dallas, this is more than just a job; it's a labour of love. - It's mahi that's meaningful. I look forward to helping others. When you see their journey at the beginning, they walk into your office, and you have the pass them the tissues and all that kind of stuff. And then a couple of sessions later, they've completely transformed in their way of their own healing. - And healing himself from the sexual abuse he endured as a kid has been a long and ongoing process. When you were at the peak of your addiction, what did that look like? Could you paint the picture? - That picture looked like a... a man who was struggling with his own demons and had no sense of hope. Hated every one, hated the world. Blamed everyone. And deep down I was just hurting. - Did you get a chance to forgive those who abused you?' - (EXHALES HEAVILY) That was powerful, because I didn't wanna forgive at all up until when I was at a crossroads at 29, 30. I knew I had to forgive. And it wasn't about taking my power away. It was more about letting it go. You have to let it go. You can't hold it in. That's not gonna help your healing journey. You need to forgive in order to grow as a person and to bring that love into you. - How is Dallas now? - Dallas is a` obviously, a new person, a person who's been rebirthed in the good. Now, I'm able to be in a position to` to help people who are... suffering now, who are suffering in silence, who need that initial support. And just knowing that there is strength in speaking out, in sharing your korero and sharing your truth. (PENSIVE MUSIC) - Kei runga noa atu koe e Dallas. Na D'Angelo Martin tera ripoata. Hei muri i nga whakatairanga ka korero maua ko Takuta Shane Reti. Labour government policies with a strong Maori focus have become a bone of contention with the Maori Health Authority, along with Three Waters and the concept of co-governance filling up headlines. The National Party has been critical of the Government's approach and vowed to disestablished the Maori Health Authority, despite decades of abysmal health outcomes for Maori. National spokesperson for health, Dr Shane Reti, says the success of Maori health providers delivering COVID vaccines shows there is no need for a Maori health authority. Hei matapaki I tenei take kua hono mai a Takuta Shane Reti. Tena koe, e te rangatira. - Tena koe, Mihi. Nga mihi ki a koe. Good to speak with you. - Ki a koe hoki. Before we get into a Maori Health Authority, I just wanted to touch` You were fairly vocal last week on a DHB decision, which was to remodel healthcare for teenagers in the Hawke's Bay, and you called it a 'stupid decision'. The change will mean 14- to 17-year-olds in the Hawke's Bay, who currently get free GP visits, will now be moved to a new service ` a new service that is better structured to deal with Maori and Pasifika. So what's so stupid about that? - What it also means is that the absolutely vital patient-doctor relationship will be broken for ease of access, and the number of people who have already complained about that, that potentially they would have to leave their long-standing and enduring network of trust with their current provider to go to a different service is something that shouldn't be navigated with cost. This was tried with VLCAs to varying degrees` that is those very low cost access services` and when they first came in, it also caused a lot of problems with people needing to leave their established GPs and go elsewhere for access to services. So that is my concern, primarily, that really important GP-patient relationship will be broken. - So the DHB has made this decision following a review which found that there has been a decline in teenagers from low` deprived areas being seen by GPs. So this is a new approach, and it's attempting to bring equity to the healthcare of that cohort of teenagers in Hawke's Bay. Isn't this your line, though? That it's healthcare for all New Zealanders, not just those who are lucky enough to have their own GP? - And so it should be for all New Zealanders. As it currently stands, it's available to all GPs to everyone in that age group, and under the review, they're now reducing that access. What would be a preferred solution would be to return where all practices, all providers and all patients had that same equal access to the service. That's a better solution. - But the report has shown that there's a decline in the most vulnerable group of teenagers in the Hawke's Bay, those that come from deprived areas, and they're not having any access. So that's unfair. So this is` Isn't this a model that actually makes things more equal? - No, there are some who are already attending those practices that are receiving the subsidy, and all that will happen is they will need to find services elsewhere as a number of mothers of children have already described around this issue. They will need to find services elsewhere outside of that long network of trust and understanding that they've already built up with their GP, and certainly as people come into their teenage years, that relationship of trust over years and years and years is absolutely vital, and it shouldn't be readily broken by a DHB who decides they either haven't accounted properly or they're not well-funded. You shouldn't be breaking the GP-patient relationship just on that basis. - Not everyone is lucky enough to have a GP. We know that ` particularly Maori and Pasifika who come from those kinds of areas. So what's your suggestion in terms of making it equal for all? - So this talks to health workforce primarily. I understand that as a Maori doctor myself seeing patients, that talks to health workforce building up that domestic cohort of culturally competent practitioners and also continuing to deal with issues of financial burden, of transport. They are still going to require attention, but just to direct people to a different provider on the basis of cost breaks, a really important principle. - OK. So your leader has recently said on Q+A that National might not scrap the Maori Health Authority if it's, you know, partly implemented. While on the other channel, Nicola Willis said it's absolutely gone. Does National have a problem with its messaging? - Not at all. Let me be clear. What has been said here is that the health workforce and health stakeholders have told us that it wouldn't be wise to undertake big structural reform if we're privileged enough to be government in 2023. - So is it gonna stay or go? Is it a goner? - And so where we'll land in 2023 will be to stabilise the sector. But the Maori Health Authority will go. It will be reabsorbed into a very strong Maori health directorate inside the Ministry of Health, and that messaging has been consistent. - Isn't that exactly what the Maori Health Authority is? That's a very big organisation inside the Ministry of Health. - No, the Maori Health Authority is a completely separate health authority, as the architect of the reforms, Heather Simpson, has described it. When it assumed commissioning powers, it became a separate health system, and that's going to create a whole lot of problems. And so, no, we will absorb it inside the Ministry of Health as a really strengthened and strong Maori health directorate. - So what are your plans for reducing inequalities then? - So a number of things. First of all, we're going to focus on a number of the really big inequities for Maori. We know that sits in cancer; we know that sits in cardiovascular disease. And what we'll do is we'll set ourselves targets` I'll hold myself accountable for those targets` that will hold the system and providers accountable for those targets. We'll go right after those Maori health outcomes that are so critical, which is so missing in these reforms. You know, a government document that says a Maori Health Authority will have no health outcomes in the first five years. That's just not tenable. And being inside the select committee where this was discussed, the expectations of the presenters to this select committee was that there would be outcomes definitely in that first year. And when I asked them what sort of outcomes might you like to see in the first year, most of them said 'Immunisation, Shane.' - So it sounds exactly like what we have already ` that you're going to target specific inequities, and you're going to try and fix them. And it basically sounds like the status quo. And as we've said before that, you know, the outcomes for Maori and Pasifika have been abysmal for decades and decades. - So several things there. First of all, if we look at, for example, life expectancy in 1840, for Maori, it was 30 years. Today it's 73.4 years. - (CHUCKLES) - So over time there has been improvements. The better question is why it's 73.4 for Maori today and 80 for Non-Maori. That's the challenge we all have actually. How do we address that delta` that difference here now. And no, a Maori Health Authority in our hands will be significantly resourced. It'll have really clear targets. It'll be well-funded and clear direction and a really strong leadership. That's what you'll see to address Maori health inequities in our hands. - That's an interesting comparison, 1840 to 2022. But let's stay on 1840. Your leader has said that` - Well, that's the point. Where you say there's been no advantages over decades and decades, we just need to be clear. We need to explain that. But again, it comes back to the better question is why today we've got that difference. That's what we need to work on. - Your leader has said that co-governance for Treaty settlements, but nothing else. Is that something that you support too? - Yeah, so it's a challenge, the principle of co-governance competing with other principles. And we know that, say, where it competes with the principle of private asset management with Three Waters, that's a challenge. And in health, as we've just been discussing with the principle of co-governance, competes with the primacy of health need. That's a challenge for us as well. So I completely support what the leader has said. - So do you agree that the Treaty settlement process is a mechanism to address the Crown breaches like, you know, the land confiscations and things like that? - I think it's a significant mechanism to address many of the failings from the Crown to Maori over many decades. It is a significant mechanism. - So let's put that to the side, and then let's deal with Article 3 of Te Tiriti which promises Maori the same rights as Pakeha, because that's not happening. So how do we deal with that? - So what that relies on` that relies on really strong collaborative actions across a range of government services, which has been moderately well-done across a number of governments, certainly not perfectly, cos we've got the issues we've got here today. But those sort of issues are going to require multi-agency involvement, and it needs to take Maori and New Zealanders with them in that decision making. And that's partly where Willie and some of his team have got into difficulty with their vision of what equity for Maori might look like. - What do you mean by that? What do yo mean by taking New Zealanders with them? Because, you know, for decades and decades, Maori have had no decision making. So what are you saying there where that we have to take New Zealanders with them when we make decisions? - So there's a lot of flack around the declaration that Willie is progressing. And one of the arguments has been that New Zealanders don't feel that they know what's happening or that they've been involved. Some Maori are saying they haven't been involved as well. Key constitutional things like we're talking about here` - Dr Reti, it was your party that signed up to that declaration. It was the National Party that signed up. - And what we signed up to wasn't` It was. And what we signed up to was a non-binding declaration which was reported back about two weeks ago. And if I look at that report back, several things strike me. First of all, none of the 46 articles in the declaration are actually addressed in that thematic analysis. I think, secondly, there's something interesting around the pre-eminence of the documents, inasmuch as that the Declaration seems to talk more about Article 3 citizenship-type, Oritetanga issues, whereas Maori in the discussion we're having here is more around Article 2 ` Tino rangatiratanga. That seems to be a bit of a disconnect. And the third thing I'd put to you is ` do we actually need a declaration? Is the Treaty of Waitangi actually not enough? And furthermore, where in the hierarchy of documents is this new declaration going to sit? Is it going to sit over the Treaty of Waitangi? Is the UN actually going to have some sort of oversight over the Treaty? I think these are discussions that need to come forward. - Are you saying` Are you actually saying that Te Tiriti o Waitangi has been enough for Maori? Is that what you're saying? - No, I'm raising the question as, when we look at addressing the declaration, which is the point you've raised, the question is whether the Treaty of Waitangi does that and more. That's what we need to discuss, and whether the UN declaration might, in some way, have pre-eminence over the Treaty and what we think about that. That would be a concern. - Just something that popped up this morning. The ACT Party is proposing to abolish a number of ministries, including Maori Development, Pasifika, Ethnic, Women's and Human Rights. Do you support that policy? - We would need to have that discussion in caucus. But our position here at the moment is no, we would not support that. But that would be pending a caucus discussion. - So if you were to form a government with the ACT party, you would oppose that policy to abolish those ministries? - No, we would need to have that discussion in caucus. - Well, can you tell me your personal view? Do you support those ministries? For women, for` - It's a` It's a caucus decision. It's not for me to make individually. - So maybe? - But the current position is that those ministries would stand. - So maybe. - No, it's a caucus decision. - But it's not a no. - It's not a position` It's not a position that I can take. What I'm telling you as here, today, that is not our current position. So today it is no. But what you've put to me would need to be discussed by caucus. - Tena koe. Ko Takuta Shane Reti tera. Kua ea nga mahi raranga korero mo tenei wa. Noho ora mai ra. (THEME MUSIC) Captions by Jessie Puru. Captions were made with the support of NZ On Air. www.able.co.nz Copyright Able 2022 - Ko te reo te taki. - Na te Puna Whakatongarewa Te Hui i tautoko.