ATA MARIE, E HOA MA. I AM REBECCA WRIGHT. AND I'M JENNA LYNCH. NAU MAI, WELCOME TO NEWSHUB NATION. FIRST ON THE PROGRAM TODAY ` BATTLEGROUND ELECTORATES WHERE THERE'S EVERYTHING TO PLAY FOR THIS ELECTION. FINN HOGAN'S DIGITAL POWER RANKINGS SPECIAL CAMPAIGN EDITION. AND YOU THOUGHT YOU KNEW JAMES SHAW. WELL, CHECK OUT HIS BACKSTORY. CAPTIONS BY KATE HARRIS AND JESSIE PURU. CAPTIONS WERE MADE WITH THE SUPPORT OF NZ ON AIR. WWW.ABLE.CO.NZ COPYRIGHT ABLE 2023 LEADING THE SHOW TODAY, AUCKLAND'S ELECTORATE TAMAKI IS COMING IN HOT AS ONE OF THE MOST EXCITING BATTLES THIS ELECTION YEAR. WE HAVE A FIGHT ON THE RIGHT. NATIONAL HAS HELD THE SEAT SINCE 1960, BUT COULD IT FLIP? WITH US TODAY ARE ALL THREE CANDIDATES. WELCOME TO THE PROGRAM ACT'S BROOKE VAN VELDEN, NATIONAL'S SIMON O'CONNOR AND LABOUR'S FESAITU SOLOMONE. WELCOME. ALL RIGHT, THE LONGEST-SERVING MP FOR TAMAKI WAS ROBERT MULDOON. WHAT'S YOUR FAVOURITE THING ABOUT HIM, BROOKE? OH, I'D HAVE TO SAY MULDOON IS KNOWN FOR A LITTLE BIT OF HUMOUR, BUT LOOK, THAT WAS WELL BEFORE OUR TIME. I THINK THE PEOPLE OF TAMAKI HAVE KIND OF MOVED ON FROM MULDOON. HE WON IT 63 YEARS AGO, AND WHAT THEY'RE LOOKING FOR IS A LITTLE BIT OF CHANGE AND A BIT OF CHOICE THIS YEAR. SIMON, YOUR FAVOURITE THING ABOUT MULDOON? THEY LOVED THE WAY THAT HE WAS ON THE GROUND. I ACTUALLY KEEP A PICTURE OF MULDOON IN MY OFFICE, NOT TO EULOGISE WHAT HE DID NATIONALLY, BUT THE LOCALS OF TAMAKI STILL SPEAK ABOUT THE WAY HE WAS AVAILABLE AND SERVED THEM. AND HE'S BEEN A GREAT INSPIRATION ON THAT FRONT. FESAITU? WELL, I WASN'T HERE AT THAT TIME, BUT I'VE HEARD A LOT ABOUT HIM AND WHAT HE'S DONE IN THE ELECTORATE AS WELL. SO FOR ME, IT'S FOLLOWING WHAT I BELIEVE IN, THE POLICIES AND VALUES. BUT, YOU KNOW, HE'S A GREAT POLITICIAN AS WELL. SO THAT'S ALL I CAN SAY. ALL RIGHT, SIMON, YOU ARE THE INCUMBENT MP IN A SEAT THAT HAS BEEN BLUE SINCE 1960, BUT NOW IT IS IN PLAY. THAT IS AN EPIC FAILURE FOR A SAFE, TRUE-BLUE SEAT, ISN'T IT? WHY ARE VOTERS LOOKING ELSEWHERE? WELL, IT'S ONLY YOU SUGGESTING THAT THE VOTERS ARE LOOKING ELSEWHERE. SOME ARE. THEY'VE ALWAYS` THE POLLS SUGGEST THEY ARE. SOME LOOK TOWARDS LABOUR, SOME TO GREEN AND SOME ACT. BUT ACTUALLY, I FEEL VERY COMFORTABLE IN THE SEAT, BUT NOT COMPLACENT. THAT'S IMPORTANT TOO ` NOT COMPLACENT. I FOUGHT EVERY ELECTION HARD, AND BROUGHT IN REALLY GOOD MAJORITIES AND LOOK FORWARD TO DOING SO AGAIN. BROOKE, VOTERS HAVE PICKED NATIONAL IN THIS ELECTORATE FOR YEARS AND YEARS AND YEARS. WHY DO YOU ALL OF A SUDDEN THINK THEY WANT YOU? WELL, LOOK, I'M STANDING FOR THE SEAT OF TAMAKI BECAUSE SO MANY PEOPLE IN THE LAST TWO AND A HALF YEARS IN THE LOCAL COMMUNITY HAVE ASKED ME TO DO IT. THEY'VE SAID, 'LOOK, WE'VE HAD THE SAME MP FOR 12 YEARS, 'BUT WE FEEL UNDERSERVED. WE DON'T FEEL LIKE THE PERSON HERE 'BEST REFLECTS OUR VALUES, AND WE WANT A BIT OF CHOICE 'AND A BIT OF CHANGE.' AND SIMON, DO YOU WANT TO SAY IT TO HIS FACE? THAT SEEMS MEAN. WELL, LOOK, I'M JUST REPEATING WHAT PEOPLE HAVE BEEN SAYING TO ME AT THEIR DOORSTEPS. AND SO I THINK IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT FOR DEMOCRACY FOR PEOPLE TO HAVE CHOICE. THE SEAT DOESN'T ACTUALLY BELONG TO NATIONAL. IT BELONGS TO THE VOTERS. AND THE VOTERS HAVE BEEN TELLING ME THEY WANT A STRONGER LOCAL VOICE IN PARLIAMENT TO REFLECT THEIR VALUES. FESAITU, DO YOU THINK YOU'RE GOING TO WIN THIS? WELL, WE NEVER KNOW BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, BOTH OF THEM` WE KNOW THAT IT'S A RIGHT WING SEAT ALL THE TIME SINCE FOR 63 YEARS, WE NEVER KNOW. THINGS MIGHT CHANGE. WHILE THEY SIT AND FIGHT THE VOTES FOR THE RIGHT, WHO KNOWS? WE MIGHT JUST COME IN THE MIDDLE AND TAKE IT. SO I'M FOCUSSED ON ENSURING THAT OUR VOTERS UNDERSTAND OUR POLICIES, VALUE WHAT WE ARE DOING AS A LABOUR PARTY AND AS A CANDIDATE AS WELL IN OUR ELECTORATE. SO THAT'S WHAT I'M WORKING FOR. SIMON, YOU WERE FIRST ELECTED IN 2011. THAT'S BEFORE SHANE RETI, CHRIS BISHOP, NICOLA WILLIS, ERICA STANFORD, CHRIS LUXON, ALL OF THEM NOW SENIOR MPS, ALL OF THEM HOUSEHOLD NAMES. WHY NOT YOU? IT'S PROBABLY BECAUSE ACTUALLY I'VE FOCUSSED SO STRONGLY ON THE SEAT OF TAMAKI RATHER THAN MY OWN CAREER DEVELOPMENT AND, TO SAY, MINISTERIAL SHIPS OR SO FORTH. ARE ALL OF THOSE OTHER PEOPLE FOCUSSED ON THEMSELVES? NO, IT'S NOT SAYING THAT, IT'S JUST THAT THEY'VE CLEARLY BEEN ABLE TO GET THROUGH IN OPPOSITION DAYS INTO SENIOR PORTFOLIOS. FOR ME, I'VE JUST LOVED WORKING WITH THE PEOPLE OF TAMAKI. I'VE DONE IT FOR 12 YEARS STANDING UP, SOMETIMES AGAINST MY OWN PARTY ON ISSUES THAT ARE IMPORTANT TO LOCALS. YEAH. COULD IT BE THAT YOU'RE SO CONSERVATIVE YOU VOTED AGAINST ABORTION REFORM, SAME SEX MARRIAGE, VOLUNTARY EUTHANASIA? YEAH. WELL, LOOK, TAKE THAT FIRST ONE. I'M ONE OF 51 MPS ACROSS THE HOUSE WHO VOTED AGAINST THE LIKES OF ABORTION. SO THE IDEA IT'S JUST ME IS ALWAYS A BIT FANCIFUL. AND SECONDLY, NO, I MEAN` YOU CELEBRATED THE ROE V WADE OVERTURNING. YOU WERE THE ONLY ONE IN THE PARLIAMENT TO DO THAT. WELL, I'M SOMEONE WHO HAS CLEAR AND STRONG OPINIONS. AND ONE OF THE GREAT THINGS, JENNA, IS ACTUALLY THE PEOPLE OF TAMAKI LOVE THAT. AS THEY WILL OFTEN SAY, THEY DON'T GO TO BED WONDERING WHAT THEIR MP THINKS, BECAUSE, ONE, I'M VERY CLEAR ABOUT MY POSITIONS AND TWO, I ENGAGE WITH THEM ALL THE TIME. YOUR LEADER HAS SAID THAT HE'D RESIGN BEFORE CHANGING ABORTION LAW REFORM. CAN YOU MAKE THAT SAME COMMITMENT THAT YOU WON'T SEEK TO CHANGE ABORTION? WELL, THE PARTY'S BEEN VERY, VERY CLEAR THAT THIS IS NOT SOMETHING ON OUR AGENDA. I MEAN, LOOK, THE COUNTRY IS IN SUCH A TERRIBLE STATE AT THE MOMENT THAT ACTUALLY THE PRIORITIES FOR US IS CLEARLY EVERYTHING FROM THE COST OF LIVING TO CRIME. FESAITU, HOW WOULD YOU HAVE VOTED ON ABORTION? I WOULD HAVE VOTED` I WOULD SUPPORT THE VOTE BECAUSE I BELIEVE IN CHOICE. AND FOR ME AS A RAINBOW WOMAN, IT'S ALWAYS BEEN ABOUT CHOICE FOR ME. REGARDLESS OF WHETHER I WAS BROUGHT UP IN THE FAITH AS A CHRISTIAN, I BELIEVE THAT PEOPLE HAVE A CHOICE TO MAKE FOR THEMSELVES, AND THAT'S A CHOICE THAT WE WANT TO SUPPORT. AND FOR ME, IT'S ALWAYS ABOUT SUPPORTING WHAT PEOPLE WANT AND GIVING THEM THE OPPORTUNITY BECAUSE WE DON'T KNOW THE CIRCUMSTANCES THAT SURROUND MANY PEOPLE. AND WE ARE NOT THE JUDGE, I GUESS. AND FOR ME, IT'S ENABLING PEOPLE TO HAVE THAT VOICE FOR THEMSELVES. BROOKE, THIS IS ONE OF THE MOST CONSERVATIVE SEATS IN THE COUNTRY. IS SIMON RIGHT ` PEOPLE WANT A CONSERVATIVE MP? OH, LOOK, WHEN YOU LOOK AT EVEN THE END OF LIFE CHOICE BILL, THE VAST MAJORITY OF PEOPLE WITHIN TAMAKI VOTED FOR CHOICE. AND THAT'S SOMETHING I BELIEVE IN TOO. AND I SHARE THE VALUES OF THE PEOPLE OF TAMAKI. I'M PRO-CHOICE WHEN IT COMES` SO YOU CALL YOURSELF A LIBERAL? I AM A LIBERAL. I BELIEVE IN BODILY AUTONOMY FOR WOMEN. I BELIEVE IN CHOICE IN ALL ASPECTS OF OUR LIVES SO WE CAN LIVE THE MOST FULFILLING LIFE FOR US. AND I'M REALLY PROUD OF THE WORK THAT I DID TO ACTUALLY HELP WRITE THE END OF LIFE CHOICE ACT WHEN I WAS WORKING FOR DAVID SEYMOUR DOWN IN PARLIAMENT. THERE'S A LOT OF PEOPLE IN OUR COMMUNITY WHO COME UP AND SAY, 'THANK YOU FOR DOING THAT BECAUSE I'VE GOT FAMILY MEMBERS WHO HAVE 'USED IT, OR I'VE SEEN A REALLY TERRIBLE DEATH.' AND FOR ME, IT'S IMPORTANT THAT WE GIVE PEOPLE CHOICE AND THAT WE REFLECT THOSE VALUES IN THE COMMUNITY. YOUR PARTY ALSO VOTED AGAINST THE SAFE ZONES OUTSIDE ABORTION CLINICS. WOULD YOU LOOK TO REPEAL THOSE SAFE ZONES IF YOU WERE IN GOVERNMENT? LOOK, I'M NOT LOOKING TO REPEAL THOSE SAFE ZONES IN GOVERNMENT. I THINK IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT THAT WE LISTEN TO THE COMMUNITY AND THE COMMUNITY ARE ACTUALLY SAYING WE DO HAVE A RIGHT TO HAVE OUR OPINION. BUT I ALSO THINK WE HAVE A RIGHT TO SAFE ACCESS TO MEDICAL SERVICES WHERE THE GOVERNMENT SAYS WOMEN HAVE THE RIGHT AND ABILITY TO CHOOSE AN ABORTION IF THAT'S WHAT'S NEEDED IN THEIR LIFE FOR THEM AND THEIR FAMILY AT THAT TIME, THAT PEOPLE ARE ABLE TO ACCESS THAT CHOICE WITHOUT COMING INTO HARM. LET'S TALK ABOUT HOUSING. BROOKE, YOU ANNOUNCED YOUR CANDIDACY IN APRIL WHEN THOSE HOUSING INTENSIFICATION RULES WERE SUPPORTED BY NATIONAL AND WE'RE ALSO DEEPLY UNPOPULAR IN THE TAMAKI ELECTORATE. NOW, NATIONAL'S FLIP-FLOPPED AND DOESN'T SUPPORT THOSE HOUSING INTENSIFICATION RULES. HAVE YOU LOST YOUR POINT OF DIFFERENCE? NO, NOT AT ALL. OUR POINT OF DIFFERENCE IN ACT IS THAT WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE HAVE SAFER STREETS. WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE HAVE A THRIVING ECONOMY. WHAT'S THAT GOT TO DO WITH INTENSIFICATION? BUT IF WE'RE TALKING SPECIFICALLY ABOUT HOUSING, LOOK, I WANT YOUNGER PEOPLE TO HAVE AN AFFORDABLE HOME TO LIVE IN. BUT THE POLICY THAT NATIONAL AND LABOUR PUT THROUGH FOR THREE THREE-STOREY HOUSES WASN'T GOING TO BUILD ANY MORE HOMES. IT WAS JUST GOING TO BUILD THEM IN COMMUNITIES WHERE WE DIDN'T HAVE THE INFRASTRUCTURE FOR THEM. SO WE ACTUALLY LISTENED TO LOCAL COUNCIL, BUILDERS, ARCHITECTS, DESIGNERS WHO SAID THIS POLICY IS NOT GOING TO WORK, BUT IT WILL JUST CAUSE CHAOS, ESPECIALLY IN TAMAKI, WHERE WE HAVE 100-YEAR-OLD PIPES. AND INTENSIFICATION WITHOUT THE INFRASTRUCTURE IS JUST NOT GOING TO WORK. OK, SIMON, YOUR ELECTORATE HAS SOME OF THE MOST EXPENSIVE HOUSING... THEY DO. ...IN THE COUNTRY. SOME OF THOSE HOUSES WOULD BE SOLD OFF TO FOREIGN BUYERS UNDER YOUR NEW TAX PLAN. YOU COMFORTABLE WITH THAT? YEAH, I AM COMFORTABLE WITH THAT ACTUALLY, BECAUSE NEW ZEALAND NEEDS FOREIGN INVESTMENT, AND IF ALLOWING PEOPLE TO BUY A HOME OVER $2M... ARE YOUR ELECTORATE COMFORTABLE WITH IT? ...AND ACTUALLY PAYING THE TAX. FOR A LOT OF PEOPLE, THEY ARE COMFORTABLE WITH THAT. THERE ARE SOME WHO DON'T UNDERSTAND IT, AND THAT'S MY JOB AS I'M OUT AND ABOUT TO EXPLAIN IT. BUT I THINK REALLY IMPORTANTLY TO, JENNA, IT WOULD BE A MISREPRESENTATION TO THINK OF TAMAKI AS ONLY THE BIG WEALTHY HOUSES. AND FESAITU I KNOW, GLEN INNES IS PART OF OUR ELECTORATE. IT'S A REALLY KEY PART OF OUR COMMUNITY. IN SOME PLACES, ACTUALLY IT'S SOME OF THE WORST POVERTY IN THE COUNTRY. AND THAT'S ONE OF MY ROLES AS A LOCAL MP TO HAVE A FOOT IN BOTH THOSE CAMPS. YEP, SO LET'S TALK ABOUT THE PEOPLE IN GLEN INNES. HOUSING, LABOUR, KIWIBUILD FAILURE, EMERGENCY HOUSING CRISIS, STATE HOUSING WAITLIST IS OUT OF CONTROL. HOW CAN WE TRUST WHAT LABOUR SAYS ON HOUSING? WELL, I MUST SAY LABOUR HAS DELIVERED OVER 12,000 HOMES` YOU KNOW, PUBLIC HOMES TO OUR PEOPLE. TAMAKI IS ONE OF THOSE AREAS ` GLEN INNES, AND IT'S NOT JUST GLEN INNES. WE LOOK AT GLENDOWIE. WE ALSO HAVE THOSE HOMES BEING BUILT IN MEADOWBANK. SO WE NEED THOSE HOMES FOR OUR PEOPLE. WE ALSO NEED TO FOCUS AS WELL ON FIRST HOME BUYERS, AND THAT'S WHY WE AGAINST ANY FOREIGN BUYERS, AS YOU MENTIONED. IT'S IMPORTANT FOR US TO HELP OUR NEW ZEALAND FAMILIES TO GET INTO THEIR FIRST HOME. BUT IT'S ALSO IMPORTANT TO RECOGNISE AS WELL IN AN AREA LIKE OURS, WE NEED ALL THE SUPPORT. HOUSING IS IMPORTANT, BUT ALSO NOT ONLY` WHEN WE TALK ABOUT HOUSING, WE HAVE TO REMEMBER THAT THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO ARE ALSO RENTING AS WELL AND THAT'S WHAT LABOUR'S ALL ABOUT. WE'RE PROTECTING RENTERS AS WELL, BUT WE'RE ALSO ENSURING THAT OUR PEOPLE CAN GET INTO FIRST HOME BUYING AS WELL. TAMAKI REGENERATION PROJECT HAS BEEN REALLY HELPFUL IN THAT SENSE THAT WE'VE PUT OUR FAMILIES BACK INTO HOMES, BUT WE NEED WARMER HOMES, AND THAT'S WHAT WE'RE PROVIDING ` BETTER FACILITIES FOR OUR CHILDREN AND THEIR FAMILIES AS WELL. THAT'S THE IRONY OF ALL OF THIS. THE TAMAKI REGENERATION PROGRAM IS EFFECTIVELY A CORPORATE THAT'S BEEN SET UP BY COUNCIL AND THE CROWN AND ACTUALLY SUPPORTED BY LABOUR AND NATIONAL AND HAS BEEN INCREDIBLY SUCCESSFUL. SO WHEN YOU COME INTO OTHER AREAS OF MY ELECTORATE LIKE MEADOWBANK OR ORAKEI, WHERE ACTUALLY, KAINGA ORA IS OPERATING AT THE MOMENT, AND IT'S GOING DOWN VERY, VERY BADLY. BROOKE, IS IT STILL YOUR PARTY'S POLICY TO PUT BENEFICIARIES ON ELECTRONIC INCOME MANAGEMENT? IT IS IF PEOPLE END UP NEEDING FINANCIAL SUPPORT AND GUIDANCE ON HOW TO STRUCTURE THEIR FINANCES WHEN THEY'RE ON A BENEFIT. IT'S NOT FOR EVERY BENEFICIARY. WHY DO YOU THINK THAT FISHERIES NEED TO BE ELECTRONICALLY MONITORED WITH THEIR INCOME IN THE MIDDLE OF A DEEP COST OF LIVING CRISIS? AREN'T THOSE PEOPLE COUNTING EVERY CENT THEY HAVE? WELL, NO, JENNA, I THINK YOU'RE MISREPRESENTING THE POLICY. WE'RE SAYING` WE ACTUALLY DO BELIEVE THERE IS A SAFETY NET FOR PEOPLE WHO SERIOUSLY NEED FINANCIAL HARDSHIP. THAT SHOULD BE THERE. BENEFITS SHOULD BE AVAILABLE FOR` THE CARD CONTROLS WHAT THEY SPEND THEIR MONEY ON, RIGHT? BUT IF THERE'S A SITUATION WHERE, SAY, YOU'VE GOT A SINGLE MOTHER WHO IS ON A BENEFIT, ENDS UP HAVING ANOTHER CHILD ON THE BENEFIT, WE WANT TO ENSURE THAT THE MONEY IS ACTUALLY GOING TO THE BEST INTERESTS OF THE CHILD. WHAT IS IT GOING TO OTHERWISE? WHAT DO YOU THINK THAT THAT MOTHER IS SPENDING THAT MONEY ON? IT'S MAKING SURE THAT THAT MONEY IS ACTUALLY GOING TO PEOPLE IN NEED AND THAT THE MONEY IS BEING SPENT ON THE KIDS, BECAUSE BENEFITS SHOULD BE THERE. BUT WHAT I'M ASKING YOU IS WHAT IS, WHAT IS IT BEING SPENT ON OTHERWISE? WHAT DO YOU THINK THAT THAT MOTHER IS SPENDING HER MONEY ON IF YOU NEED TO CONTROL THE WAY THAT SHE'S SPENDING HER MONEY? LOOK, IT'S A BELIEF OF OURS THAT BENEFITS SHOULD BE THERE TO HELP PEOPLE, BUT THEY SHOULD BE THERE FOR A SHORT PERIOD OF TIME... YOU'RE NOT ANSWERING THE QUESTION. ...TO HELP PEOPLE GET UP FROM A TERRIBLE SITUATION OR WHEN THEY NEED HELP. BUT IF SOMEBODY IS ON A BENEFIT AND THEY THEN END UP HAVING ANOTHER CHILD ON A BENEFIT, WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE ACTUALLY WRAPPING SUPPORT AROUND THAT FAMILY AND WE'RE GIVING SUPPORT, FINANCIAL SUPPORT, SO THAT KID IN THAT HOME MAKES SURE THAT THEY HAVE RENT PAID FOR THEM, THEY HAVE FOOD COMING IN. BUT YOU'VE GOT TO LOOK AT THIS. YOU MENTIONED THE COST OF LIVING CRISIS. PEOPLE ARE REALLY` YOU'VE GOT TO COME DOWN TO GLEN INNES AND SEE THESE FAMILIES THAT AREN'T GOING TO BE TAKEN IN BY JUST SIMPLE POLICY STATEMENTS. THESE ARE FAMILIES WHO ARE STRUGGLING BIG TIME, WHO ARE DOING EVERYTHING THEY CAN IN AN EXTRAORDINARY SITUATION, AND THEY NEED TO BE GIVEN SOME HOPE. YEP, WE'VE GOT TO WRAP SOME STRENGTH AROUND IT, BUT THERE'S GOT TO BE SOME HOPE. 40% OF VOTERS IN THIS ELECTORATE, SIMON, EARN OVER $150,000. WHY DO THEY NEED A TAX CUT WHEN THE PEOPLE IN GLEN INNES NEED THE MONEY MOST? WELL, THE PEOPLE IN GLEN INNES ARE GOING TO RECEIVE THAT TAX CUT AS WELL. OUR TAX CUT, THAT BACK POCKET BOOST, IS ACTUALLY TARGETING THE SQUEEZED MIDDLE. SO ACTUALLY A LOT OF PEOPLE IN TAMAKI WON'T BE RECEIVING ENORMOUS AMOUNTS OF MONEY. DO YOU GET IT? I THINK RACHEL AND I WILL END UP PROBABLY WITH ABOUT $10 OR SO. ARE YOU THE SQUEEZED MIDDLE? NO, WE'RE DEFINITELY NOT THE SQUEEZED MIDDLE. SO YOU'RE GETTING A TAX CUT WHEN YOU'RE NOT THE SQUEEZED MIDDLE. WE ARE AT THE PERIPHERIES. AS I SAY, THE SQUEEZED MIDDLE IS WHERE IT'S GOING. IF YOU'RE A MUM AND DAD WITH A COUPLE OF KIDS, YOU COULD BE UP TO ABOUT $250 A FORTNIGHT, WHICH IS FANTASTIC. TAMAKI, AS I SAID, IS ONE OF THE MOST WEALTHY ELECTORATES IN THE COUNTRY. ARE HEADS REALLY GOING TO BE TURNED BY GST-FREE FRUIT AND VEGETABLES IN YOUR ELECTORATE? YES, DEFINITELY. I'M NOT SAYING THAT IT'S NOT A BAD THING. IT'S A GREAT THING. AND I'VE SPOKEN TO A LOT OF FAMILIES. IT'S A WHOLE DIFFERENCE BEING MADE TO A LOT OF OUR FAMILIES BECAUSE HEALTHY FOOD IS WHAT WE PROMOTING, AND IT'S GOING TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE FOR THEM TO BUY APPLES AND PEARS AND ANY FRUITS THAT THE KIDS WANT, ESPECIALLY FOR HEALTHY SCHOOL LUNCHES AS WELL. I BELIEVE THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE'RE TARGETING AS WELL IN TERMS OF OUR FAMILIES. AND IT'S NOT JUST THAT. LABOUR'S LOOKING AT FAMILY TAX CREDITS. WE'RE GIVING THEM PUBLIC TRANSPORT AS WELL. HALF PRICE FOR THOSE WHO ARE BELOW 24, AND ALSO UP TO 13 IS FREE. SO IT HELPS FAMILIES. DO YOU KNOW WHAT YOUR PUBLIC TRANSPORT POLICY IS? COS YOUR PARTY'S GOT THIS WRONG OVER THE LAST COUPLE OF DAYS ` ARE DISABLED PEOPLE GETTING FREE PUBLIC TRANSPORT UNDER LABOUR? YES, I'M PRETTY SURE` NO THEY'RE NOT, THEY'RE GETTING HALF PRICE. CLIMATE ` TAMAKI IS A COASTAL ELECTORATE. BROOKE, ACT WANTS OUT OF THE GOVERNMENT'S CLIMATE PLAN. BUT WILL YOU COMMIT TO OUR OBLIGATIONS TO THE 2030 OBLIGATIONS UNDER THE PARIS AGREEMENT? LOOK, WHAT I AM IS I'M AN ENVIRONMENTALIST, AND I DO WANT TO SEE ACTION ON CLIMATE CHANGE. WHAT I DON'T AGREE WITH GOVERNMENT POLICIES AT THE MOMENT WHERE WE SPEND BILLIONS OF DOLLARS, BUT WE DON'T ACTUALLY REDUCE EMISSIONS. THAT'S WHAT I'M OPPOSED TO. REMEMBER, I USED TO VOTE GREEN. THIS IS WHY I GOT INTO POLITICS. I WANT TO LEAVE THE WORLD A BETTER PLACE. 2030 ` YES OR NO? WELL, I DON'T THINK IT'S A POLICY THAT COULD ACTUALLY HAPPEN IN 2030. BECAUSE IF WE DON'T HIT IT, IT'S GOING TO COST US BILLIONS OF DOLLARS, SO YOU'RE GOING TO HURT OUR ECONOMY. WHAT I THINK WE NEED ARE PROPER ENVIRONMENTAL STANDARDS AND POLICIES THAT WILL ACTUALLY REDUCE EMISSIONS. AT THE MOMENT, WE'VE GOT THE ZERO-CARBON ACT. IT JUST PAINTS PEOPLE AS BAD OR GOOD AND SAYS THAT THE CLIMATE CHANGE MINISTER HAS A LOT OF POWER OVER WHO SHOULD BE TAXED AND WHO SHOULD BE SUBSIDISED. I THINK THAT'S WRONG. I THINK WE'VE GOT TO LOOK AT NEW TECHNOLOGY, NEW INNOVATION, HELPING FARMERS AND THE ECONOMY AT THE SAME TIME. SO YOU THINK OF THINGS LIKE RYE GRASSES WHICH COULD BE PLANTED IN NEW ZEALAND SOIL, WHICH COULD REDUCE METHANE PRODUCTION IN COWS BY UP TO 30%. IT'S AN INTERNATIONAL AGREEMENT WE'VE SIGNED UP TO. AND WE'RE GOING TO GET BASICALLY FINED IF WE DON'T DO IT. NATIONAL, WILL YOU DO IT? WE ARE COMMITTED TO THAT. WE'RE COMMITTED TO THE 2050 TARGETS AS WELL. WE'RE COMMITTED TO OBVIOUSLY LOOKING AT THE SCIENCE, BUT WE'RE ON THE GROUND NOW. I MEAN, THIS IS A TAMAKI DEBATE. SO IF YOU'RE IN MY` WHERE I LIVE IN SAINT HELIERS, YOU'RE SEEING THE SEAGRASS HAS COME BACK BECAUSE ACTUALLY WORK'S BEEN DONE. NGATI WHATUA ORAKEI HAVE DONE AMAZING JOBS IN OKAHU BAY. FIRSTLY CLEARING OUT THE BOATS, WHICH I WAS VERY SUPPORTIVE OF. AND DROPPING IN TENS OF THOUSANDS OF MUSSELS TO CLEAN THE WATER. AND WE'VE JUST PASSED A LAW IN PARLIAMENT ` AND KUDOS TO LABOUR ` AROUND MORE PROTECTION IN THE HAURAKI GULF. BUT I'M CERTAINLY THE LOCAL MP SAYING MORE NEEDS TO BE DONE, AND THESE ARE THE REAL THINGS NOW, NOT JUST TALK. FESAITU, YOUR FINANCE MINISTER DIDN'T EVEN GIVE JAMES SHAW A HEADS UP THAT HE WAS GOING TO RAID THE CLIMATE EMERGENCY RESPONSE FUND OF $236M. CAN WE TRUST LABOUR ON THE CLIMATE? YEAH, DEFINITELY. I MEAN, WE'RE ALL FOR IT. WE SUPPORT IT. HE WAS ADVISED LATER ON, AND I KNOW IT'S A DECISION THAT HE WELCOMED AS WELL, EVEN THOUGH HE WAS NOT ADVISED EARLIER` JAMES SHAW WELCOMED THE CLIMATE FUND BEING RAIDED? NO, HE ACTUALLY AGREED IN TERMS OF THAT` THAT'S A DECISION THAT LABOUR DID, AND THEY HAD TO DO THAT IN TERMS OF EXPENSES. YOU MIGHT HAVE TO BRING JAMES IN. HE MIGHT BEG TO DIFFER ON THAT ONE. LOOK, I MEAN, AT THE END OF THE DAY, YOU KNOW, HE ACCEPTS THE FACT THAT THEY HAD TO MAKE A DECISION BASED ON THAT. AND AS A MINISTER, HE KNOWS THAT IT'S NEEDED THE MOST. BUT WE ARE FOCUSING ON OTHER THINGS, AND ESPECIALLY FOR TAMAKI, THE GOVERNMENT HAS PUT SOME MONEY TO FINISH THE PROJECTS THAT WE STARTED OFF, YOU KNOW, HAVING ALL THAT PUSH TO HAVE OUR PEOPLE WALK AND RIDE THEIR BIKES. WALK ` THAT'S IMPORTANT FOR US IN TERMS OF THE GREEN ENVIRONMENT. OK. I WANT TO PLAY A QUICK QUICKFIRE ROUND OF KEEP OR SCRAP POLICIES. READY? FEES-FREE. SCRAP. KEEP. KEEP. FOOD IN SCHOOLS? SCRAP. KEEP. KEEP. SUPER FUND CONTRIBUTIONS. OH. PAUSE. I THINK WE WANT TO RESTART THEM WHEN WE CAN. THEY'RE ALREADY STARTED. SO ARE YOU GOING TO PAUSE THEM? SORRY? WE'RE CURRENTLY CONTRIBUTING TO THE SUPER FUND. ARE YOU GOING TO PAUSE THAT? OH, I THOUGHT NATIONAL THAT HAD THE SUGGESTION AT ONE POINT, I THINK, OF TRYING TO PULL THEM BACK, IF I RECALL. SO... KEEP. AND FIRST TIME GRANT. OH, SCRAP. KEEP. KEEP. OK. QUICK QUIZ. WHAT BUS WOULD YOU CATCH IF YOU WERE HEADING TO TAMAKI FROM BRITOMART? THE 75. GOING ALONG REMUERA ROAD. THAT IS CORRECT. THAT'S A LOCAL MP, FOLKS. AND NOW IT'S TIME FOR YOU` NOW YOU'VE GOTTA ASK ME HOW OFTEN I TAKE THAT BUS. HOW OFTEN DO YOU GET TO THE BUS? ACTUALLY, I CATCH IT OCCASIONALLY. IT'S MORE MY STEPKIDS AND OTHERS THAT WE LOOK AFTER THAT DO. ALL RIGHT. HERE IS YOUR ONE SHOT, ONE OPPORTUNITY. YOU'VE GOT 10 SECONDS EACH. LOOK DOWN THE BARREL OF THIS CAMERA AND TELL VOTERS WHY THEY SHOULD VOTE FOR YOU IN TAMAKI. BROOKE. I'M STANDING IN TAMAKI TO GIVE PEOPLE CHOICE AND CHANGE FOR THE BETTER. THIS ELECTION, YOU COULD VOTE TO HAVE MORE OF THE SAME OR SOMETHING DIFFERENT. PEOPLE IN THE COMMUNITY ARE WANTING CHANGE, CHANGE OF GOVERNMENT, AND A CHANGE LOCALLY FOR A STRONGER LOCAL VOICE. SIMON. ULTIMATELY, IT'S A TWO TICKS BLUE. WE NEED YOU TO PARTY VOTE NATIONAL. AND YOU WANT A NATIONAL MP THERE AT THE TABLE. AND IN ME, OVER THESE LAST FEW YEARS, YOU HAVE HAD AN MP WHO HAS SERVED EVERY DAY TO MAKE TAMAKI A BETTER PLACE ON THE BASIS THAT IT ALREADY IS GREAT. BUT EVERY DAY I'VE SERVED THIS COMMUNITY, AND LOOK FORWARD TO DOING SO AGAIN. FESAITU. TWO TICKS FOR LABOUR ` I WOULD SAY IT'S IMPORTANT FOR YOU TO KNOW THAT THE POLICIES THAT LABOUR HERE FOR IS TO SUPPORT OUR PEOPLE ` THE MOST VULNERABLE, BUT NOT JUST YOU PEOPLE, BUT EVERYBODY IN THE ELECTORATE AS WELL. WE WANT TO BE THERE FOR YOU REGARDLESS OF WHO YOU ARE IN THE ELECTORATE, AND WE WANT YOU TO VOTE AND HAVE YOUR VOICE HEARD COME OCTOBER 14TH AS WELL. NO ONE KNOWS WHAT 10 SECONDS IS, BUT THANK YOU ALL FOR JOINING ME. FOLKS, THOSE ARE YOUR CANDIDATES FOR TAMAKI. HOPEFULLY THAT WAS ILLUMINATING FOR ALL THE VOTERS OUT THERE. STAY WITH US. WE'RE BACK AFTER THE BREAK. HOKI MAI ANO, WELCOME BACK. WELL, THE POLITICAL ENERGY SHIFTED THIS WEEK AS THE OFFICIAL ELECTION CAMPAIGN BEGAN. IT'S A CAMPAIGN THAT THESE DAYS, THOUGH, IS FOUGHT JUST AS BITTERLY OUT THERE ON THE INTERNET. SO DIGITAL EDITOR FINN HOGAN IS HERE WITH US TO DISCUSS. AND FINN, WHAT IS HAPPENING OUT THERE, WEEK ONE? WELL, GOOD MORNING, REBECCA. IF WE TAKE A LOOK AT OUR TOP 10, IT'S THE GOVERNMENT'S NIGHTMARE TRIO BACK IN THE POLE POSITION. WE'VE GOT SEYMOUR, LUXON AND PETERS HOLDING ON TO THOSE TOP POSITIONS. CHRIS HIPKINS SLIDING INTO FOURTH. I THINK LABOUR'S REALLY WANT TO GOING TO SEE A LITTLE BIT MORE OF THAT CHIPPY UNLEASHED ENERGY COMING OUT TO BUMP UP THOSE NUMBERS. ARDERN FAMOUSLY SORT OF STAYED OUT OF THE FRAY A LITTLE BIT, BUT HIPKINS HAS A BIT OF AN EDGE WHEN HE LEANS INTO HIS MINISTER FOR MEMES PERSONA. SO I THINK HE'S GOING TO WANT TO BE DOING THAT A LITTLE BIT TO BUMP UP HIS NUMBERS. DAVID SEYMOUR ON THE OTHER HAND, HE'S HOLDING ON TO THAT LEAD POSITION PARTIALLY BECAUSE HE'S POSTING JUST A LOT MORE THAN THE OTHER CANDIDATES. AND I THINK THAT SHOWS THAT HE'S REALLY TRYING TO LEAN INTO THAT AURA OF BEING PRESUMPTIVE DEPUTY PRIME MINISTER IF THERE IS A CHANGE OF GOVERNMENT. THE BIG BARBIE BUS WOULDN'T HAVE HURT HIM EITHER. SIMON O'CONNOR IS IN THE TOP FIVE, THOUGH. HE SEEMS TO OVERPERFORM IN OUR DIGITAL POWER RANKINGS QUITE REGULARLY. WHAT IS DRIVING THAT? YEAH, IT'S INTERESTING WITH SIMON O'CONNOR. IF WE DIG INTO HIS NUMBERS A LITTLE, HE'S ACTUALLY GOT WAY MORE VIDEO VIEWS THAN BASICALLY ANY OTHER CANDIDATE WE MEASURE ` OVER TWO MILLION, WHICH IS QUITE IMPRESSIVE. HIS SOCIAL MEDIA POSTS BEFORE HAVE GOT HIM INTO TROUBLE, BUT HE DOES HAVE A KNACK FOR POSTING THE KIND OF MEME HUMOUR WHICH TENDS TO DO QUITE WELL ON FACEBOOK, PARTICULARLY WITH THE OLDER DEMOGRAPHICS WHICH ARE COMING TO DOMINATE THERE. HE POSTED AN AUSTIN POWERS CLIP RECENTLY, WHICH I THINK IS QUINTESSENTIAL. LIKE, IT'S THE DEFINITION OF A BOOMER POST. BOOMER VIBE. BUT LOOK, THAT'S THE DEMOGRAPHIC THAT IS COMING TO DOMINATE ON FACEBOOK. THEY'RE MUCH MORE LIKELY TO VOTE. HE KNOWS HIS AUDIENCE, SO IT'S A SMART PLAY. WHAT ABOUT THE PARTY PAGES? WHO IS DOING WELL? YEAH, SO IT'S INTERESTING ON THE PARTY PAGES, IF WE LOOK INTO THE NUMBERS A LITTLE BIT, IT'S BASICALLY NECK AND NECK BETWEEN LABOUR IN TERMS OF OVERALL ENGAGEMENT. BUT NATIONAL DO HAVE A BIT OF A LEAD WHEN IT COMES TO VIDEO VIEWS AND THE INTERACTION RATE. INTERACTION RATE'S BASICALLY JUST HOW LIKELY PEOPLE ARE TO CLICK ON YOUR CONTENT. BUT IT'S IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER THAT NATIONAL'S ON THE ATTACK. LABOUR'S PRIMARILY ON THE DEFENCE. SOCIAL MEDIA ALGORITHMS VERY MUCH PRIORITISE ATTACK OVER DEFENCE, SO THERE IS A BIT OF AN ADVANTAGE THERE. MEANWHILE, ACT IS FIFTH, EVEN DESPITE ALL OF SEYMOUR'S SUCCESS. TE PATI MAORI AND GREEN PARTY AREN'T EVEN RANKING IN THESE TOP FIVE RIGHT NOW. BUT REMEMBER, WE'RE MEASURING OVERALL ENGAGEMENT. ENGAGEMENT DOESN'T EQUAL SUPPORT. FACEBOOK DOES NOT CARE IF YOU LOVE OR HATE CONTENT; ONLY CARES IF YOU CLICK ON IT. ALSO IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER ` THE MORE YOU POST, THE MORE CLICKS YOU'RE LIKELY TO GET. SO IF WE LOOK AT THAT TOP FIVE, WE SEE VISION NZ AND THE OUTDOORS AND FREEDOMS PARTY REPRESENTED, BUT THEY ARE POSTING NEARLY 10 TIMES A DAY ON AVERAGE. SO, YOU KNOW, QUANTITY OVER QUALITY. (CHUCKLES) CERTAINLY. SO WHERE ARE TE PATI MAORI AND THE GREENS? YEAH, SO IF WE LOOK AT FURTHER DOWN THE RANKINGS, THEY'RE COMING IN IN SIXTH AND SEVENTH, AND THEN YOU'VE GOT NEW ZEALAND FIRST AND TOP AFTER THEM, AND NEW ZEALAND FIRST HAVE ALWAYS SORT OF STRUGGLED IN THIS AREA TO SORT OF HAVE A DOMINANT PARTY PAGE PERFORMANCE OUTSIDE OF WINSTON'S SHADOW, AND WE'RE STARTING TO SEE THAT REFLECTED A LITTLE BIT WITH SEYMOUR AND ACT. I THINK OVERALL, IT'S QUITE A DISAPPOINTING RESULT FOR TOP PARTICULARLY. IF THEY'RE TRYING TO ANGLE THEMSELVES AS THE YOUNG, ONLINE, TECH-FOCUSED PARTY, THEY'RE REALLY GOING TO NEED TO BUMP THOSE NUMBERS UP AND CHANGE THEIR STRATEGY IF THEY'RE GOING TO GET A PATH TO PARLIAMENT. THAT'S SO FASCINATING. AND WITH THE ELECTION LOOMING, SURELY NOW IS THE TIME TO BE SPENDING ON SOCIALS. SO WHAT INVESTMENT ARE WE SEEING? WE'RE SEEING A LOT. ACT HAVE TURNED ON THE MONEY HOSE. THEY'VE SPENT NEARLY $100,000 ON META ADVERTISING IN THE LAST 30 DAYS ALONE. BUT INTERESTINGLY, IT'S NOT SEEING MASSIVE GAINS FOR THEM IN TERMS OF THE PARTY PAGE ` AGAIN SHOWING THAT SEYMOUR'S A VERY DOMINANT BRAND BUT DOESN'T NECESSARILY SPLASH BACK ON TO THE PARTY PAGE. AND IF WE LOOK AT THE OTHER PARTIES, LABOUR'S DOING PRETTY WELL FOR THE PARTY PAGE DESPITE SPENDING THE LEAST, AND I THINK THAT'S SORT OF THE INCUMBENT ADVANTAGE. LOVE IT OR HATE IT, IT'S VERY HARD TO NOT SEE THEIR CONTENT. GREENS HAVE SPENT $31,000 IN AD SPEND BUT HAVEN'T GOT A BIG CUT THROUGH, NOT EVEN MAKING IT INTO THE TOP FIVE. BUT I THINK THAT DOES REFLECT THAT THE SORT OF ACTIVIST BASE OF THE GREENS ARE INCREASINGLY NOT ON FACEBOOK. THEY'RE MOVING OFF SOCIAL MEDIA AND TO THINGS LIKE TIKTOK. SO I THINK THAT'S WHY THEY STRUGGLE TO GET CUT THROUGH EVEN WHEN THEY'RE SPENDING MONEY. SO WE'VE SEEN LABOUR UNDER FIRE THIS WEEK FOR MISLEADING POSTS. ACT'S CANDIDATE STEPPING DOWN FOR OLD POSTS. JAMES SHAW GOT INTO TROUBLE. HE WAS CORRECTING HIS LINKEDIN RECORD. ARE WE EXPECTING MORE SOCIAL MEDIA SNAFUS? 100%. I MEAN, LOOK, THIS HAS BEEN THE MOST ONLINE ELECTION I CAN REMEMBER, AND IT'S BARELY EVEN BEGUN. BUT I THINK THE LESSON THAT WE'RE TAKING FROM THIS IS SOCIAL MEDIA ` VERY DOUBLE-EDGED SWORD. AN ATTACK AD CAN REACH MILLIONS OF PEOPLE VERY QUICKLY, BUT A MISTAKE LIVES FOREVER AND CAN REACH ALL THOSE PEOPLE JUST AS FAST. A GOOD RULE, ACTUALLY, FOR LIFE. THANK YOU SO MUCH, FINN HOGAN, FOR THOSE DIGITAL POWER RANKINGS. A MURI AKE NEI, WE WILL BE BACK WITH OUR POLITICAL PANEL ` SIMON WILSON, DR LARA GREAVES AND MATTHEW HOOTON. PLUS ` THEY ARE THE ONES TO WATCH ` TWO MORE BATTLEGROUND ELECTORATES AFTER THE BREAK. HOKI MAI ANO. WELCOME BACK. WELL, THIS ELECTION, THE MINOR PARTIES COULD BECOME MAJOR PLAYERS. AND ONE OF THE PARTIES WHO LOOKS SET TO CAPITALISE ON THAT MOOD FOR CHANGE IS TE PATI MAORI. IN 2020, THEY EARNED THEIR WAY BACK INTO PARLIAMENT WITH ONE SEAT ` WAIARIKI ` AND NOW THEY'RE LOOKING TO PICK UP AT LEAST ONE MORE. THAT COULD BE THE ELECTORATE OF TE TAI HAUAURU, WHERE CO-LEADER DEBBIE NGAREWA-PACKER IS STANDING. BUT IN A REGION WHERE HISTORY AND WHAKAPAPA REACH ACROSS POLITICAL DIVIDES, NOTHING IS CERTAIN, AS SIMON SHEPHERD REPORTS. THREE WAHINE TOA BATTLING FOR ONE HUGE AND CRUCIAL MAORI ELECTORATE. CRUCIAL BECAUSE A TIGHT ELECTION MAY MEAN... TE PATI MAORI COULD BE CHOOSING THE NEXT PRIME MINISTER OF NEW ZEALAND. YEP, AND I GUESS WE WILL MAKE SURE THAT WE WEIGH UP EVERYTHING THAT HAS MADE US WHO WE ARE TODAY TO BE INVOLVED IN THOSE DISCUSSIONS. DEBBIE NGAREWA-PACKER LOST BY ONLY 1050 VOTES IN 2020. WHAT IS IT LIKE CAMPAIGNING THIS TIME AS OPPOSED TO 2020? WELL, I THINK MY FAMILY ARE REALLY RELIEVED BECAUSE I NO LONGER HAVE TO TAKE THEM ALONG WITH ME TO FILL EMPTY SEATS. A SUCCESSFUL TERM MEANS SHE DOESN'T HAVE NAME RECOGNITION PROBLEMS NOW, NOR DOES SHE HAVE HER PREVIOUS COMPETITOR, LABOUR'S ADRIAN RURAWHE, WITH HIS STRONG TIES TO THE RATANA CHURCH. THE AYES HAVE IT. RURAWHE MOVED ON TO THE LIST AFTER BECOMING SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE. THAT'S CREATED AN OPPORTUNITY FOR NGAREWA-PACKER, AND A SURPRISE OPPORTUNITY FOR LABOUR LIST MP SORAYA PEKE-MASON, WHO HAS ONLY BEEN IN PARLIAMENT FOR 10 MONTHS. ARE YOU TOTALLY COMMITTED TO IT? ABSOLUTELY COMMITTED TO IT. I HAD A RESPONSIBILITY TO RUN AND DO MY ABSOLUTE BEST. PEKE-MASON ALSO HAS TIES TO RATANA. WHEN JACINDA ARDERN ATTENDED FOR THE LAST TIME AS PRIME MINISTER, SHE WAS THERE TO WELCOME HER. FOURTH GENERATION FOLLOWER OF THE FAITH AND MOVEMENT. MARRIED` MY HUSBAND'S FROM THERE. HE'S SIMILAR ` GENERATIONAL FOLLOWER OF THE FAITH AND MOVEMENT. I SERVED ON THEIR NATIONAL BODY FOR ALMOST 15 YEARS OF THE RATANA MOVEMENT. SORAYA PEKE-MASON IS ACTUALLY FROM WHANGANUI. I COME FROM A VERY HUMBLE UPBRINGING JUST DOWN THE ROAD HERE IN CASTLECLIFF KOKOHUIA, STRUGGLING MUM, WIDOWED VERY, VERY YOUNG, WITH SIX CHILDREN. I'VE EXPERIENCED WHAT IT'S LIKE TO BE A SOLO MUM AND TO BE STRUGGLING, SO I KNOW WHAT STRUGGLE STREET LOOKS LIKE. KIA ORA ANO E. THE THIRD CANDIDATE STANDING ALSO WHAKAPAPAS TO WHANGANUI. NATIONAL LIST MP HARETE HIPANGO IS FROM PUTIKI, WITH LINEAGE STRETCHING BACK TO RERE-O-MAKI. SHE SIGNED THE TREATY OF WAITANGI ON THE 23RD OF MAY 1840 AT PUTIKI, AND SHE WAS ONE OF FEW MAORI WOMAN TO DO THAT. AND THERE WAS THE RECOGNITION IN TERMS OF THE LEADERSHIP THAT COMES FROM OUR WOMEN AS WELL, NOT JUST OUR MEN. HIPANGO IS WELL-KNOWN ` A FORMER WHANGANUI MP. AS A YOUNG LAWYER, SHE REPRESENTED PROTESTERS DURING THE MOUTUA GARDENS PAKAITORE OCCUPATION. NO OTHER LAWYER IN THE TOWN PREPARED TO ADVOCATE AND REPRESENT THOSE PERSONS WHO WERE CHARGED AND ARRESTED. THAT WAS ME. THAT WAS MY PROFESSIONAL JOB TO DO THAT. IT'S THE FIRST TIME IN 20 YEARS NATIONAL HAS STOOD CANDIDATES IN THE MAORI ELECTORATES, AND HIPANGO HAS SOME HIGH-PROFILE SUPPORT. THIS ONE HERE. LOOK AT YOU. THAT'S A YOUNG ME. THAT'S A YOUNG YOU. I WAS OBVIOUSLY SHARING SOME VIEWS THAT YOU WEREN'T PARTICULARLY AGREEABLE TO AT THE TIME. NO, NO, NO. DAME TARIANA TURIA, FORMER LABOUR MP IN TE TAI HAUAURU, WHO CROSSED THE FLOOR AND SET UP THE MAORI PARTY AFTER THE FORESHORE AND SEABED HIKOI. IT IS THE BEGINNING OF A NEW MAORI MOVEMENT. SHE ALSO CALLS PUTIKI HOME. AND I THINK THAT'S SOMETHING THAT, AS MAORI, WE'RE QUITE GOOD AT DOING BECAUSE THE IMPORTANCE OF SITTING HERE UNDER THE MAHOE AT PUTIKI, RECOGNISING THE POWER OF WHAKAPAPA AND THE IMPORTANCE OF WHANAUNGATANGA. ABSOLUTELY. I LOVE THIS PLACE. THERE IS ALSO SHARED HISTORY ACROSS THE CANDIDATES. AND HERE WE ARE HERE. WE'RE THERE. THE FORESHORE AND SEABED WAS A FORMATIVE MOMENT FOR DEBBIE NGAREWA-PACKER, BUT WHEN IT COMES TO THIS ELECTION, ONE ISSUE DOMINATES. PEOPLE CALL IT COST OF LIVING. IT'S SUCH AN EXTENUATION OF THAT. SO THE POVERTY, THE DISPLACEMENT THAT HAS COME AS A CONSEQUENCE OF THAT. THE COST OF LIVING IS TOP OF THE AGENDA. HOW CAN THEY AFFORD HEALTHY, NOURISHING KAI, WHEN THE COST OF IT IS JUST ESCALATED? TE TAI HAUAURU WHO HAS BEEN HELD BY LABOUR SINCE 2014, BUT THE PARTY IS POSITIONING ITSELF AS THE UNDERDOG. BUT DOES THAT MEAN IT'S TE PATI MAORI'S FOR THE TAKING? I THINK WE'RE A FORCE TO BE RECKONED WITH THESE ELECTIONS. IN SAYING THAT, I DON'T TAKE ANYTHING FOR GRANTED. YEAH, FASCINATING RACE HAPPENING DOWN THERE. SIMON SHEPHERD REPORTING. FURTHER SOUTH, THOUGH, CHRISTCHURCH'S ILAM ELECTORATE WAS A NATIONAL STRONGHOLD THAT FLIPPED TO LABOUR IN 2020. THIS YEAR NATIONAL'S HAMISH CAMPBELL IS HOPING THAT IT WILL RETURN TO TYPE, BUT THERE IS A WILD CARD. RAF MANJI, WHO'S DOING HIS BEST TO TRY TO UPSET THE RACE AND USE THE ELECTORATE AS A PATH TO POWER FOR THE OPPORTUNITIES PARTY. HERE IS FINN HOGAN. CHRISTCHURCH'S ILAM ELECTORATE ` A SAFE SEAT FOR NATIONAL UNTIL THREE YEARS AGO, WHEN SARAH PALLET FLIPPED IT FOR LABOUR. I'M OPTIMISTIC. I'M QUIETLY CONFIDENT. PALLETT, WHO'S 51ST ON LABOUR'S LIST, SAYS SHE'S RUNNING ON HER RECORD. I'VE BEEN WORKING REALLY HARD FOR THE PAST THREE YEARS, SO I'M REALLY HOPEFUL THAT PEOPLE SEE THAT, RECOGNISE THE GOOD WORK THAT I'VE BEEN DOING, AND THAT I'VE JUSTIFIED THEIR TRUST IN ME WHEN THEY ACTUALLY MADE THAT TICK IN 2020. I THINK IF WE HAD A HEAD-TO-HEAD BETWEEN ME AND NATIONAL, I THINK I'D COME OUT ON TOP RIGHT NOW. THE CANDIDATE HOPING TO RECLAIM THE SEAT NATIONAL'S GERRY BROWNLEE HELD SINCE 1996, IS HAMISH CAMPBELL, WHO'S COUNTING ON AT LEAST FIVE VOTES FROM THESE YOUNG NATS. 100% WITH A 1% MARGIN OF ERROR. (LAUGHTER) I'D LIKE TO BE THE MP FOR ILAM, AND THAT WOULD BE IN A NATIONAL-LED GOVERNMENT. SO I WOULD BE A STRONG VOICE IN CAUCUS TO DELIVER THESE CHANGES. WHAT'S YOUR ARGUMENT FOR WHY IT SHOULD BE YOU SPECIFICALLY, NOT JUST TWO TICKS BLUE, NO MATTER WHO? I HAVE A REALLY SIMPLE PHILOSOPHY THAT EVERYBODY DESERVES A FAIR SHOT AT LIFE, AND I THINK THAT WE HAVE POLICIES THAT ARE GOING TO DELIVER THAT, AND I THINK THAT'S WHAT THE PEOPLE OF ILAM WANT. BUT ACCORDING TO THE INCUMBENT, IF NATIONAL WINS, IT WON'T BE BECAUSE OF HAMISH. I THINK WE'VE GOT A LOT OF COMPETITION ON THE LEFT-HAND SIDE OF THE VOTE THERE. YOU'RE BACK. ROSIE, HI. WELCOME. NICE TO SEE YOU. THANKS FOR HAVING ME. COMPETITION IN THE FORM OF RAF MANJI, LEADER OF THE OPPORTUNITIES PARTY, AND FORMER CHRISTCHURCH COUNCILLOR. NO, I WOULDN'T DESCRIBE HIM AS A PROGRESSIVE CANDIDATE AT ALL, ACTUALLY, NO. I MEAN, WHEN YOU ACTUALLY DIG INTO THE POLICIES A LITTLE BIT MORE, YOU'LL SEE THAT THE POLICIES THAT HE'S GOT FOR STUDENTS, FOR EXAMPLE, ACTUALLY PRIMARILY BENEFIT LANDLORDS. WELL, SHE HASN'T READ OUR POLICIES AND DOESN'T UNDERSTAND OUR TAX POLICY. I WOULD SAY WE ARE PRO-BUSINESS AND WE'RE PRO-PEOPLE. SHE'S BEEN INVISIBLE. NOBODY HAS SEEN HER. SHE HAS VERY LOW AWARENESS, AND SHE DOESN'T HAVE A VOICE. I THINK WHAT'S CLEAR FROM MY COMPETITORS IS THEY DON'T HAVE THE EXPERIENCE. THEY HAVEN'T ACTUALLY SERVED. THEY HAVEN'T ACTUALLY BROUGHT POLICIES IN. THEY HAVEN'T ACTUALLY DELIVERED THINGS. I'VE DONE THAT, AND I'LL BE ABLE TO DO THAT AGAIN. THAT'S NOT REALLY FAIR. SARAH DOES ACTUALLY HAVE EXPERIENCE. SHE'S BEEN THE MP FOR THE LAST THREE YEARS. I MEAN, NOT DELIVERED` NOTHING'S BEEN DELIVERED. YOU'VE GOT LOCAL GOVERNMENT EXPERIENCE, NOT CENTRAL GOVERNMENT EXPERIENCE. BUT I DEALT WITH CENTRAL GOVERNMENT AFTER THE EARTHQUAKES. I KNOW HOW CENTRAL GOVERNMENT WORKS. I'VE SAT IN THE OFFICES OF THE LAST TWO PRIME MINISTERS. BUT A RECENT TAXPAYERS' UNION CURIA POLL, NATIONAL'S INTERNAL POLLSTER, PUT HAMISH WAY IN FRONT, MEANING TIME COULD BE UP FOR T.O.P. THE WAY THE ELECTORAL MATHS IS GOING TO WORK OUT, IF I WIN ILAM, AND WE BRING IN MAYBE THREE TO FOUR MPS, WE WILL HAVE SOME INFLUENCE IN THE NEXT GOVERNMENT. REALISTICALLY, THIS IS THE LAST SHOT FOR T.O.P. PROBABLY. I MEAN, LOOK, I MEAN 5% THRESHOLD WE KNOW IS EXTREMELY TOUGH. A LOT OF PARTIES HAVE TRIED. NO NEW PARTY HAS GOT IN. I THINK WE'LL DO IT THIS TIME. THE LAST CHANCE FOR ONE PARTY, IN A THREE-WAY CONTEST THAT COULD CHANGE THE FACE OF PARLIAMENT. E WHAI AKE NEI ` ALL OF THE HIGHLIGHTS FROM THE FIRST WEEK OF THE OFFICIAL ELECTION CAMPAIGN PLUS ` CHILDHOOD MEMORIES, FAMILY AND ROMANCE IN JAMES SHAW'S BACKSTORY. HOKI MAI ANO, WELCOME BACK. WELL, THEY ARE OFF THE LEASH. POLITICAL ANIMALS OF ALL STRIPES WERE RELEASED THIS WEEK INTO THE WILD, CANVASSING THE COUNTRY FOR THOSE ELUSIVE SWING VOTERS. AND HERE ARE SOME OF THE HIGHLIGHTS. NOW. THE POLITICAL RACE IS ON. NO, NO, NO, NO. THE LABOUR LEADER ON THE STREETS OF NEWTOWN. GOOD TO SEE YOU. GOOD TO SEE YOU. A SPECIAL DAY FOR THE PRIME MINISTER... WHO LIKES FOOD? KIDS: ME! IT'S MY TURN NOW. YOU'VE HAD YOUR TURN. THE DEMONSTRABLY INFLATIONARY TAX PLAN THAT DOESN'T ADD UP. RIGHT NOW, OUR TAX SYSTEM IS NOT FAIR. I WOULDN'T TRUST YOU TO RUN THE ECONOMY OF VENEZUELA, LET ALONE NEW ZEALAND. TURNING DOWN HIS FAVOURITE DELICACY... IS THAT THE FIRST SAUSAGE ROLL YOU'VE EVER TURNED DOWN? POSSIBLY. WHOA! CATCH IT! TICKLE ME. AN ARTIFICIALLY INTELLIGENT HUMANOID. ARE YOU COMMITTED TO A COMPLETELY HONEST AND CLEAN CAMPAIGN? YES. (LAUGHTER) DESPITE THE BANANA BIFFED AT THEM AND THE HECKLERS, NICOLA'S A TRAIN WRECK! I'M VERY SCEPTICAL OF THIS GOVERNMENT'S ABILITY TO GET ANYTHING DONE, IF I'M HONEST WITH YOU. I'M NOT FOCUSED ON LOSING. I'M FOCUSED ON WINNING. CAN YOU? ABSOLUTELY. WELL, I AM JOINED NOW BY OUR PANEL, SENIOR WRITER AT THE HERALD, SIMON WILSON, WELCOME, ASSOCIATE PROFESSOR AT VICTORIA UNIVERSITY, DR LARA GREAVES, WELCOME TO YOU, AND PR CONSULTANT MATTHEW HOOTON, WHO HAS WORKED FOR BOTH NATIONAL AND ACT AND THE MONGOLIAN... (LAUGHTER) ONLY ONCE. ONLY ONCE. WELL, IT'S A FASCINATING FACT. OK, SO WE HAVE GOT A REAL BATTLE GOING ON OUT IN TAMAKI. WE'VE SEEN THE CANDIDATES THIS MORNING. WHAT DOES THAT SAY, THAT A TRUE BLUE SEAT IS IN PLAY ON THE RIGHT OVER THERE, SIMON? WELL, I THINK THAT YOU HAVE TO REMEMBER TAMAKI IS NEXT TO EPSOM. EPSOM HAS VOTED ACT FOR THE CANDIDATE FOR A LONG TIME NOW. SO IT'S NOT UNUSUAL, REALLY, THAT YOU COULD ARGUE THAT ACT'S TAKEN A BIT OF TIME TO COME TO THE REALISATION THAT MAYBE THEY COULD WIN THAT NEXT SEAT. IT IS A BIG PLAY ON THE GENERAL ISSUES OF WHETHER THE` WHETHER PEOPLE ON THE RIGHT WANT A MORE LIBERTARIAN PARTY THAT IS DETERMINING TO CHANGE THINGS OR WHETHER THEY'RE MORE HAPPY WITH THE CENTRE RIGHT APPROACH. BUT ALSO THERE'S THAT OVERLAY OF BROOK VAN VELDEN BEING A LIBERAL HERSELF, VERSUS FUNDAMENTALIST OR CONSERVATIVE CHRISTIAN, AND SO THERE'S A REAL CHALLENGE THERE FOR A DEFINING OF WHAT THE CENTRE RIGHT IS GOING TO BE, AND IT'S PLAYING OUT IN TAMAKI. YES. IS THIS A SNAPSHOT, I SUPPOSE, LARA, OF WHAT WE'RE SEEING A BIT ON THE RIGHT IN THIS ELECTION ANYWAY, WITH VOTES MOVING BETWEEN ACT AND NATIONAL? THAT'S HAPPENING IN A MORE MACRO LEVEL AS WELL, ISN'T IT? YEAH, WE'RE DEFINITELY SEEING THAT CONTESTATION ON THE RIGHT WITH A STRONG ACT PARTY, AND I'M SURE WE'LL SEE IT ON THE LEFT WITH THE GREENS AND LABOUR AS WELL. ONE OF THE THINGS ABOUT MMP IS IT'S KIND OF BEDDED IN NOW. PEOPLE ARE GETTING A BIT MORE USED TO IT. THE MILLENNIALS ARE 40, AND THAT'S ALL WE'VE REALLY KNOWN IS MMP. SO THAT'S KIND OF, I GUESS WHAT WE CAN TEND TO EXPECT AND ONE OF THE STRENGTHS OF A PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION SYSTEM. WELL, WE KNOW THAT BROOKE HAS STYLE. DOES SHE HAVE SUBSTANCE, MATTHEW? SHE'S UNTESTED AS AN ELECTORATE MP CERTAINLY, BUT ALSO POSSIBLY FOR A MINISTERIAL POST, TOO. BIG TEST COMING FOR HER. WELL, I GAVE HER HER FIRST JOB, SO I THINK SO, OBVIOUSLY. SHE'S THE ONLY MP IN ALL OF PARLIAMENT ` THIS IS QUITE SHOCKING ` WITH AN ECONOMICS DEGREE, AND SHE'S ALSO GOT AN INTERNATIONAL RELATIONS DEGREE. YOU WOULD THINK THERE WOULD BE MORE THAN JUST ONE, BUT IT'S HER. AND I THINK IN TERMS OF KNOWING POLITICS, SHE WORKED WITH DAVID SEYMOUR ON THAT BILL, ON EUTHANASIA, AND TO GET A MEMBER'S BILL THROUGH PARLIAMENT IS AN EXTRAORDINARY ACHIEVEMENT, AND THAT FORCED HER TO WORK ACROSS PARTIES. SO IN TERMS OF KNOWING HOW PARLIAMENT WORKS, HOW WELLINGTON WORKS, I MEAN, SHE'S WELL ABOVE AVERAGE IN OUR PARLIAMENT. SHE'S OFF TO A FLYING START. WE HAVE IN 2020, OF COURSE, SAW THIS RED TSUNAMI. NOBODY EXPECTED IT REALLY AT THE TIME TO BE AS BIG AS IT WAS. BUT WHAT THAT MEANS NOW THAT LABOUR'S SUPPORT IS DIPPING IS THAT WE ARE SEEING LOTS OF SEATS THAT FLIPPED BACK THERE THEN IN 2020 COME BACK INTO PLAY. WHAT IS INTERESTING FOR YOU AT THE MOMENT, SIMON? WELL, I JUST WANTED TO PICK UP ON THAT POINT ABOUT BROOKE VAN VELDEN BEING THE ONLY ECONOMIST IN PARLIAMENT. WE DO NEED ECONOMISTS IN PARLIAMENT. WE ALSO NEED TRUCK DRIVERS AND CLEANERS AND TEACHERS AND PEOPLE FROM ALL WALKS OF LIFE. SURE, BUT YOU'D THINK YOU MIGHT HAVE 10 ECONOMISTS. BUT THE FASCINATING THING FOR TAMAKI, IF YOU LOOK AGAIN AT EPSOM, EPSOM HAS ALWAYS VOTED NATIONAL FOR THE PARTY VOTE AND FOR A LONG TIME ACT FOR THE CANDIDATE VOTE. AND DAVID SEYMOUR HAS ALWAYS SAID THESE ARE THE SMARTEST VOTERS IN THE COUNTRY. BUT ACTUALLY, I'VE ALWAYS BEEN PUZZLED WHY EPSOM VOTERS DON'T GIVE BOTH THEIR TICKS TO ACT. AND THAT'S A QUESTION THAT WILL BE IN PLAY THIS TIME. BOTH PARTIES ARE CLAIMING THEY'RE GOING TO RUN A TWO-TICKS CAMPAIGN IN EPSOM, AND IT WILL BE` IT IS THE SAME IN TAMAKI AS WELL. WILL PEOPLE VOTE BROOKE VAN VELDEN BUT ALSO NATIONAL, OR WILL THEY GIVE BOTH THEIR TICKS TO ONE SIDE OR THE OTHER? THAT'S A REALLY FASCINATING WAY TO LOOK AT THIS ELECTORATE NOW. YEAH, ABSOLUTELY, AND YOU HAVE YOUR EYE ON AUCKLAND CENTRAL? YEAH, I'VE BEEN WATCHING AUCKLAND CENTRAL BECAUSE THAT WAS A STRANGE ONE LAST TIME ROUND. AND OBVIOUSLY CHLOE SWARBRICK RAN A GREAT CAMPAIGN. BUT IF YOU LOOK AT THE TURNOUT BETWEEN 2017 AND 2020. 6000 MORE VOTES APPEARED, AND CHLOE ONLY WON BY ABOUT 1000. SO I'M NOT 100% SURE WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN THERE. I THINK THOSE DYNAMICS ARE REALLY INTERESTING BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, ON THE ONE HAND IT'S LIKE, YEAH, SHE'S GOT A PROFILE, CHLOE'S GOT A PROFILE. SHE HAS BEEN DOING A LOT FOR THE ELECTORATE, BUT ON THE OTHER HAND, 2020 WAS JUST A REALLY WEIRD ELECTION. MATTHEW, ANYTHING THAT STRIKES YOU ABOUT THE RACES THAT WE'RE SEEING KIND OF TAKE OFF AROUND THE COUNTRY AT THE MOMENT? WELL, I THINK ACT NOW HAS, WHAT, 15 TIMES THE SUPPORT THAT IT HAS IN THE PAST. SO I WOULD THINK IN EPSOM, YOU WOULD SEE ACT AND THE GREENS BOTH DO WELL. THE GREENS NORMALLY DO WELL IN EPSOM AND PLACES LIKE THAT. AND IN TAMAKI, I THINK THAT YOU WILL SEE DOUBLE-TICKING OF ACT THERE. I DON'T ACTUALLY THINK THAT WHAT'S GOING ON IN TAMAKI THOUGH IS THAT REPRESENTATIVE OF THE REST OF THE COUNTRY. I THINK IT'S A PARTICULAR CASE WHERE THE NATIONAL CANDIDATE PROBABLY WOULD BE MORE COMFORTABLE IN SORT OF A CHRISTIAN TYPE PARTY RATHER THAN SORT OF` THAT BEING LED BY BRIAN TAMAKI. HE HAS EXCEPTIONALLY STRONG VIEWS IN THAT AREA. AND, YOU KNOW, I DON'T SEE A SPLIT BETWEEN CONSERVATIVES AND LIBERALS HAPPENING IN THE COUNTRY GENERALLY. NATIONAL'S A COALITION OF THE TWO, AND IT SEEMS TO BE WORKING... IT'S UNLIKELY TO HAPPEN IN TAMAKI AS WELL, BECAUSE IF YOU LOOK BACK TO 2017, O'CONNOR HAD 63.5% OF THE VOTE. THAT'S A HUGE MARGIN. IT'S STILL UNLIKELY THAT VAN VELDEN IS GOING TO WIN IN TAMAKI REALISTICALLY, UNLESS THERE IS SOME KIND OF THAT STRATEGIC VOTING HAPPENING ON A MASS LEVEL. I WOULDN'T BET AGAINST HER AT ALL IN TAMAKI. IKAROA-RAWHITI I JUST WANT TO TOUCH ON REALLY BRIEFLY, LARA, BECAUSE THAT IS ANOTHER RACE THAT SEEMS TO BE WIDE OPEN. YEAH, AND MYSTERIOUS, BECAUSE IT'S THAT THING OF HOW MANY VOTERS ` AND THIS IS THAT BIG QUESTION UNDER MMP ` HOW MANY VOTERS ACTUALLY AREN'T PAYING A LOT OF ATTENTION? AND THEY'RE JUST LIKE, 'YEP, I'M A RED PERSON, I'M A BLUE PERSON,' 'I'M GOING TO TICK THAT BOX. I DON'T REALLY KNOW THAT PERSON. 'THEY SHOWED UP TO A SCHOOL FAIR ONCE. COOL, WHATEVER.' AND THAT'S ACTUALLY THE PEOPLE WE DO NEED TO THINK ABOUT, THAT, YEAH, IT'D BE GREAT IF PEOPLE WERE FOLLOWING POLITICS AND BEING STRATEGIC AND REALLY VOTING FOR WHO ACTUALLY BEST FITS THEIR NEEDS AND THEIR POLICY NEEDS. BUT THE REALITY IS... YEAH, SO IN IKAROA-RAWHITI, I'M WATCHING TO SEE HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE JUST LABOUR VOTERS VERSUS ARE SUPPORTING MEKA WHAITIRI SPECIFICALLY. THERE'S IS A COLLAPSE ON, THOUGH, IN THE LABOUR VOTE, AT PRESENT. THE POLLS ARE PRETTY DIRE FOR LABOUR. THEY WILL WISH THEY HAD HAD A SNAP ELECTION BACK IN APRIL BEFORE THE BUDGET, BUT ANYWAY, AND THOSE VOTES ARE NOW UP FOR GRABS. THE GREENS WILL GET QUITE A LOT OF THEM I WOULD HAVE THOUGHT IN THE MAORI ELECTORATES, THIS HAS GOT TO BE ONE OF THOSE CHANCES WHERE... THEY'RE AIMING FOR SEVEN ` I THINK THEY'LL GET FIVE. AND I LOOK UP NORTH. REMEMBER TAU HENARE WON THAT IN ` WAS IT '93? AND THE NORTH TENDS TO FEEL THAT IT'S NOT RESPECTED BY THE TWO BIG PARTIES AND IT DOES ODD THINGS FROM TIME TO TIME, INCLUDING VOTING FOR WINSTON PETERS. SIMON WANTS TO PICK UP. I'LL JUST SAY, I'M NOT SURE I WOULD OVERSTATE THE COLLAPSE ON FOR LABOUR. THE POLLS ` MOST OF THE POLLS WE'VE SEEN ` HAD BEEN TAKEN BEFORE THE PARTY LAUNCHES LAST WEEKEND. LABOUR HAD A GOOD PARTY LAUNCH WHERE THEY ESTABLISHED THE IDEA THAT THEY'RE IN THIS FIGHT AND THEY'RE SERIOUS ABOUT IT, AND THEY HAD THEIR FREE DENTAL POLICY, AND THAT WAS VERY STRONG FOR THEM. NATIONAL ALSO HAD A STRONG LAUNCH IN THE SENSE THAT THEY LOOKED LIKE WINNERS, AND THAT WAS THEIR AIM THERE. BUT, YOU KNOW, I DON'T THINK YOU CAN SAY THAT THE LABOUR ARE OUT OF IT BY ANY MEANS. LABOUR WILL NEED TO SEE AND POTENTIAL LABOUR VOTERS WILL NEED TO SEE POLLS THAT HAVE A THREE IN THE FRONT OF THEM. AND AT THE MOMENT WE'RE JUST SEEING 2, 2... LABOUR'S IN THE 20S AT THE MOMENT. IT'S LOST NEARLY HALF ITS SUPPORT. YOU KNOW, THIS HAS NEVER HAPPENED BEFORE AT THIS POINT AND ONCE PEOPLE THINK IT CAN'T WIN, THEN THEY EITHER DON'T VOTE OR THEY GO LOOKING FOR A SMALL PARTY AND IT BECOMES SELF-FULFILLING. TURN OUT. IF YOU'RE A LEFT WING PERSON, WHY WOULDN'T YOU VOTE FOR THE GREENS? I MEAN, LABOUR WON'T EVEN REFORM THE TAX SYSTEM. THAT ARGUMENT IS COMPELLING. THERE'S SIMILAR ISSUES GOING ON ON THE RIGHT BUT FOR GOODNESS SAKE, LABOUR'S MEANT TO TAX THE RICH TO GIVE THE MONEY TO THE POOR, AND IT REFUSES TO. SO, CRAZY. LARA, IT DOES FEEL LIKE A LONG TIME AGO ALREADY SINCE WE SAW LABOUR'S DENTAL POLICY AND THESE BIG CAMPAIGN LAUNCHES. A WEEK, THEY SAY, IS A LONG TIME IN POLITICS. BUT IT DOES SEEM THAT THAT WAS A SURPRISING MOMENT IN THE CAMPAIGN. I DON'T THINK ANYBODY WAS EXPECTING OR PREDICTED THAT POLICY, BUT IT HAS` I SUPPOSE HEADS HAVE TURNED TO OTHER PARTIES RELATIVELY QUICKLY SINCE THEN, HAVEN'T THEY? YEAH, I MEAN, IT'S GOING TO BE A QUICK MOVING CAMPAIGN. THERE'S GOING TO BE` SEEMS LIKE THERE'S BEEN LOTS OF POLICY ANNOUNCEMENTS. I MEAN, GOING BACK TO THE DENTAL POLICY, I DO THINK THAT, THIS ELECTION, COMING BACK TO WHAT YOU GUYS ARE SAYING, IS GOING TO COME DOWN A LOT TO TURNOUT AS WELL. SO IT'S LIKE, DO PEOPLE FEEL MOTIVATED ENOUGH TO SHOW UP TO VOTE? I MEAN, THERE'LL BE A LONG ADVANCE VOTING PERIOD AND A LOT OF PROMOTION GOING ON, BUT WILL PEOPLE BOTHER ULTIMATELY? AND I THINK THAT THAT'S SOMETHING THAT THE PARTIES ARE GOING TO BE LOOKING TO STRATEGIZE TO SEE WHO THEY CAN AND CAN'T TURN OUT. I MEAN, THAT'S QUITE FIRM IN THE SORT OF POLITICAL SCIENCE LITERATURE, EVEN IN NEW ZEALAND, AND IT KIND OF REFLECTS ON PREVIOUS ELECTIONS LIKE 2005, WHERE TURNOUT WAS INCREDIBLY CRUCIAL TO THE LABOUR VOTE. A VERY CYNICAL ELECTORATE AT THE MOMENT. YOU KNOW, THEY HAD NINE YEARS OF JOHN KEY 'BRIGHTER FUTURES' AND NOTHING AND ADDRESSING THE UNDERCLASS, AND FOR NINE YEARS, NOTHING HAPPENED. AND THEN IT'S EVEN BEEN MORE RIDICULOUS OVER THE LAST SIX YEARS. SO YOU'VE GOT 15 YEARS OF PEOPLE HEARING PROMISES FROM POLITICIANS WHICH ARE PLATITUDES ON THE FACE OF IT, BUT THEY HAVEN'T EVEN BEEN DELIVERED TO THAT EXTENT. I THINK A COUPLE OF OTHER THINGS ARE GOING TO HAPPEN. I THINK YOU'RE QUITE RIGHT THAT PEOPLE WHO WANTED SOME KIND OF TAX REFORM OR STRUCTURAL REFORM ON THE LEFT WILL BE LOOKING SERIOUSLY AT THE GREENS, PERHAPS TE PATI MAORI AS WELL. BUT ALSO, I THINK AS WE GET CLOSER TO ELECTION DAY, A NUMBER OF PEOPLE IN THE MIDDLE ARE GOING TO START THINKING BACK OVER THE LAST THREE YEARS AND REALISING THAT LABOUR DID AN AWFUL LOT TO SAVE THIS COUNTRY FROM ECONOMIC AS WELL AS HEALTH DISASTER. AND ALTHOUGH PEOPLE HAVE SOURED SINCE, I THINK THEY'LL START REMEMBERING THAT AGAIN. PEOPLE ARE GOING TO TUNE IN. IN THOSE LAST FEW WEEKS, I SUPPOSE, PEOPLE START TO TUNE IN MORE AND MORE. BUT I WANT TO JUST QUICKLY FINISH ON A COLUMN THAT LIAM DANN FROM THE NEW ZEALAND HERALD WROTE EARLIER THIS WEEK. HE WROTE AN EXCELLENT COLUMN, I THOUGHT, ABOUT THE MAJOR PARTIES' LACK OF A PLAN FOR WEALTH CREATION AND PRODUCTIVITY. YOU KNOW, NEITHER PARTY IS REALLY SPEAKING TO BUSINESS AND WHAT THEY'RE GOING TO DO. THESE ARE IMPORTANT AREAS FOR US IN THE LONG TERM. IS IT A BIG GAP, MATTHEW, FOR OUR MAJOR PARTIES AT THIS TIME IN THE ELECTION CAMPAIGN? IT'S THE MOST PATHETIC OFFERING FROM THE TWO MAIN PARTIES I'VE EVER SEEN OR EVEN IMAGINED. I MEAN, WE HAVE INFLATION FOR THE FIRST TIME IN 30 YEARS. WE HAVE A BALANCE OF TRADE DEFICIT THAT IS WORSE THAN IN MULDOON'S TIME, THE WORST IN NEW ZEALAND HISTORY. WE HAVE A FISCAL DEFICIT ` YOU KNOW, WHETHER IT WAS JUSTIFIED OR NOT BECAUSE OF COVID ` IS UNPRECEDENTED. THE PREVIEW WILL COME OUT IN THE WEEK AHEAD. PEOPLE WILL` WE PROBABLY HAVE TO EXPECT CLOSE TO A DECADE OF DEFICITS. AND THE TWO MAIN PARTIES THINK THE SMART THING TO DO IS TO THROW FUEL ON THE INFLATION FIRE WITH TAX CUTS OR WORKING FOR FAMILIES HANDOUTS. THESE ARE NOT SERIOUS PEOPLE. AND IT'S... GOOD LINE. (CHUCKLES) WELL, THEY'RE NOT. IF YOU COMPARE THEM TO THE PEOPLE, RUTH RICHARDSON OR SUE BRADFORD, TAKE YOUR PICK ` THEY WERE SERIOUS PEOPLE. SIMON, WE'VE GOT 40 SECONDS. THAT IS RETAIL POLITICS, THOUGH, ISN'T IT, THAT WE'VE SEEN SO FAR FROM THE MAJOR PARTIES. DO THEY NEED TO ADDRESS PRODUCTIVITY AND WEALTH CREATION IN BUSINESS? THEY DO NEED TO ADDRESS THAT. THEY ALSO NEED TO ADDRESS THE REALITY THAT WE NOW KNOW IN THIS COUNTRY IS REALLY BIG IN RELATION TO CLIMATE CHANGE. YOU HAVEN'T MENTIONED THAT. THIS COUNTRY NEXT YEAR AND THE YEAR AFTER AND THE YEAR AFTER WILL FACE ENORMOUS PRESSURES ON THE WAY WE LIVE AND ON THE ECONOMY. AND NEITHER MAJOR PARTY HAS ANY SERIOUS WAY OF APPROACHING THAT. AND THAT IS A REAL PROBLEM. YEAH, IT IS A REAL PROBLEM. THANK YOU. WE HAVE RUN OUT OF TIME, AS ALWAYS. IT'S GONE BY WAY TOO FAST. BUT THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING US, SIMON WILSON, LARA GREAVES AND MATTHEW HOOTON. THANK YOU. WELL, STAY WITH US. WE WILL BE BACK RIGHT AFTER THE BREAK. WELCOME BACK TO BACKSTORY, WHERE WE GO BEHIND THE SCENES AND WE GET TO KNOW OUR MPS A LITTLE BIT BETTER. THIS WEEK, GREEN CO-LEADER JAMES SHAW TAKES US ON A TRIP DOWN MEMORY LANE TO HIS CHILDHOOD SUBURB OF ARO VALLEY. SO THE HOUSE I GREW UP IN IS JUST BEHIND ME HERE, AND WE MOVED IN WHEN I WAS IN ABOUT MY MID-TEENS. AND THEN I WOULD WALK TO WELLINGTON HIGH SCHOOL, WHICH IS ABOUT 15 MINUTES DOWN IN THAT DIRECTION. AND THEN I WALKED TO VICTORIA UNIVERSITY, WHICH IS ABOUT 15 MINUTES IN THAT DIRECTION. MOVED IN AS A TEENAGER, MOVED OUT IN MY 20s SOMETIME, WENT OVERSEAS. WHEN I GOT BACK IN 2010, I WAS STAYING WITH MY FOLKS FOR A WHILE UNTIL MY WIFE AND I GOT A PLACE IN NORTHLAND, WHICH IS WHERE WE ARE NOW. ATE HERE ON A FAR MORE REGULAR BASIS THAN I SHOULD HAVE. (LAUGHS) BUT I WAS A TEENAGE BOY AND, YOU KNOW, YOU COULD CONSUME PRETTY MUCH ANYTHING. IT WAS FINE. AND IT'S A REALLY LOVELY FAMILY WHO HAVE BEEN HERE SINCE WELL BEFORE I GOT INTO THE VALLEY. AND THIS PARTICULAR VIDEO STORE IS WORLD FAMOUS, AT LEAST HERE IN ARO VALLEY. WHEN I FIRST STARTED COMING HERE AND WHILING AWAY MY YOUTH, THEY HAD JUST INVENTED THIS THING CALLED THE COMPACT DISC. GET SOME FISH AND CHIPS FROM DOWN THE ROAD FROM THE ARO STREET FISH SHOP AND KIND OF WALK UP AND THEN JUST WATCH REALLY BAD MOVIES AND EAT FISH AND CHIPS. AND THAT WAS PRETTY MUCH MY TEENAGE YEARS. THIS IS THE WELLINGTON HIGH SCHOOL LIBRARY. I WAS A TERRIBLE STUDENT. YOU KNOW, I... YEAH, YEAH. I TALKED IN CLASS. I DIDN'T GO TO CLASS. I DIDN'T DO MY ASSIGNMENTS. I DIDN'T DO MY HOMEWORK. I SORT OF CHAFED AGAINST AUTHORITY. I WAS GREAT AT ENGLISH. YOU KNOW, I COULD WRITE REALLY WELL AND LOVED WRITING, LOVED CREATIVE WRITING. SO I WAS 12, AND I WAS SITTING AT THE BACK OF THE CLASS IN MY INTERMEDIATE SCHOOL. MY TEACHER HAD OBVIOUSLY BEEN TALKING FOR A WHILE, BUT THE FIRST WORDS I HEARD HIM SAY WERE, 'COUNTRIES GO TO WAR OVER THINGS LIKE THIS.' AND THAT REALLY GRABBED MY ATTENTION. AND IT WAS THE MORNING AFTER THE RAINBOW WARRIOR HAD BEEN BOMBED IN AUCKLAND HARBOUR BY THE FRENCH SECRET SERVICE. IT KIND OF OUTRAGED ME. AND SO, REALLY, IN THAT MOMENT WAS WHEN I BECAME AN ENVIRONMENTALIST. SO I WAS SITTING ON THE FLOOR WATCHING AN ELECTION DEBATE IN THE 1990 GENERAL ELECTION. YOU KNOW, IT'S MY LAST YEAR OF HIGH SCHOOL. AND THE GREEN CANDIDATE, THIS GUY CALLED GARY, JUST TALKED ABOUT THINGS THAT I THOUGHT WERE REALLY IMPORTANT. RIGHT? LIKE THE STATE OF THE PLANET THAT WE LIVE ON AND WHETHER WE'RE GOING TO BE ABLE TO HAVE ENOUGH RESOURCES TO BE ABLE TO SHARE AROUND AND THOSE KINDS OF ISSUES. SO I WENT UP TO GARY AT THE END OF IT AND I SAID, YOU KNOW, 'HOW CAN I HELP?' SO I ENDED UP VOLUNTEERING ON THE WELLINGTON CENTRAL CAMPAIGN FOR A GUY CALLED STEVEN RAINBOW WHO WAS RUNNING FOR WELLINGTON CENTRAL FOR THE GREENS THAT YEAR. AND THAT KIND OF, I GUESS, STARTED MY POLITICAL JOURNEY. I'M KIND OF LUCKY IN THAT I'M A WELLINGTON-BASED MP, SO WE SEE EACH OTHER FOR BREAKFAST, CERTAINLY DURING SITTING WEEKS BECAUSE I HAVE TO BE IN WELLINGTON, BUT IT IS A DISCIPLINE TO MAKE SURE THAT YOU DON'T JUST FILL UP EVERY AVAILABLE MOMENT. AND I THINK IT'S PRETTY EASY TO DO THAT. BUT I THINK THAT JUST COMES WITH EXPERIENCE. YOU KNOW, I WAS RAISED BY A SOLO MUM UNTIL I WAS` I CAN'T REMEMBER EXACTLY WHEN, BUT IT WAS ABOUT 10, 11, 12, SOMETHING LIKE THAT. SO MY OTHER MOTHER, MUM'S PARTNER ` THEY MET AND HAVE BEEN TOGETHER EVER SINCE. I MEAN THEY BOTH MEAN AN ENORMOUS AMOUNT TO ME. THEY'VE BEEN HUGE SUPPORTERS OF ME IN MY POLITICAL CAREER. I WAS LIVING IN LONDON. I WASN'T WORKING, AND I WAS SO POOR I WAS EATING A CAN OF BAKED BEANS A DAY. LONDON IS A VERY HARD CITY TO BE BROKE IN. DEFINITELY, FOR SURE, THE LOWEST MOMENT OF MY LIFE. AND THE THING WAS THAT, ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THAT, I KIND OF THOUGHT, WELL, IF THAT'S ROCK BOTTOM, THEN ACTUALLY, EVERYTHING ELSE IS FINE. SO I THINK I'VE HAD A SENSE OF PERSPECTIVE SINCE THEN. A COUPLE OF YEARS AFTER THAT, I DECIDED THAT I WAS GOING TO COME BACK AND RUN FOR PARLIAMENT. I THOUGH, I NEED TO GIVE MYSELF SOME ENDURANCE BECAUSE THIS IS GOING TO BE A MARATHON. SO I DID THE LONDON MARATHON, AND I'D NEVER RUN BEFORE. I RAN IT AND COMPLETED IT. LIKE, WHILE I'M CLEARLY NOT MARATHON FIT NOW, IN A KIND OF RUNNING SENSE, IN A PHYSICAL SENSE, THAT KIND OF KNOWING WHAT ENDURANCE FEELS LIKE IN YOUR MIND, I THINK HAS BEEN... EVERYTHING IN THIS JOB. MY MUM USED TO HAVE ONE OF THOSE. WE'RE HELPING TO SERVE LUNCH AT THE NEWTOWN COMMUNITY CENTRE. SO THIS IS A COMMUNITY FACILITY WHERE ANYBODY WHO WOULD LIKE SOME KAI CAN ROCK UP AT LUNCH AND BE SERVED AS PART OF THE COMMUNITY. THIS IS REALLY WHAT WORKS, RIGHT, IS COMMUNITY ` PEOPLE CARING FOR OTHER PEOPLE, INCLUDING PEOPLE THEY'VE NEVER MET BEFORE. IN 2011, I WAS NUMBER 15 ON THE GREEN PARTY LIST AND WE GOT 14 MPS ELECTED. KENNEDY GRAHAM, WHO WAS ONE OF OUR MPS AT THE TIME, AND A BIG RUGBY FAN, SAID, 'YOU KNOW, SOMETIMES THE BALL BOUNCES TOWARDS YOU, 'AND SOMETIMES IT BOUNCES AWAY. 'YOU JUST PLAY THE BEST GAME THAT YOU CAN.' BUT IT'S A FUNNY SHAPED BALL. I'D LIKE TO DO THE TE ARAROA TRAIL, YOU KNOW, THE LENGTH OF NEW ZEALAND. I THINK THAT WOULD BE AN AMAZING EXPERIENCE AND THINGS THAT I DON'T REALLY KIND OF GET TIME FOR NOW. IN TERMS OF WORK, I MEAN, I'M A CLIMATE CHANGE GUY, RIGHT? SO IF I'M DOING IT IN POLITICS, I'LL BE TRYING TO FIGHT THE CLIMATE CRISIS. IF I'M NOT IN POLITICS, I WILL ALSO BE FIGHTING THE CLIMATE CRISIS. GREEN CO-LEADER JAMES SHAW THERE. AND THERE IS ALWAYS SOMETHING NEW OR SURPRISING TO LEARN ABOUT EVEN THE MOST FAMILIAR FACES ON BACKSTORY. WELL, THAT IS ALL FROM US FOR NOW. A SPECIAL THANKS TO JENNA LYNCH, WHO STEPPED IN AT THE LAST MINUTE TO FILL IN FOR SIMON, WHO WILL BE BACK WITH US NEXT WEEK. NGA MIHI NUI, WE WILL SEE YOU AGAIN NEXT WEEKEND. CAPTIONS BY KATE HARRIS AND JESSIE PURU. CAPTIONS WERE MADE WITH THE SUPPORT OF NZ ON AIR. WWW.ABLE.CO.NZ COPYRIGHT ABLE 2023 HE MEA TAUNAKI TE HOTAKA NEI NA TE PUBLIC INTEREST JOURNALISM FUND