Captions were made with the support of NZ On Air. www.able.co.nz Copyright Able 2023 - Tonight ` broken promises... - They need to own their stuff and front up and give everyone their money back. - The cancelled tour still rarking up fans. - If I was a person who took, like, everybody's money, there's no way in hell I'd get away with it. - We ask why Crusty Demon ticketholders are still waiting for refunds? - Do you feel like you have some obligation to your fans to take it on the chin, take the financial hit and do some shows in New Zealand? - And when's a New Zealand company not a New Zealand company? - I've learnt the hard way. - Anyone in whole world ` doesn't matter where they are ` can operate .co.nz website. - Plus, we answer a burning safety question. - What about 'microwave safe'? I mean, I just thought that meant it wouldn't wreck the pattern. - Tena koutou katoa ` welcome to the show. Back in November last year, we started looking into dozens of complaints about the cancellation of the Crusty Demons motor-cross tour, and the thousands of dollars in missing refunds. - And here we are nearly a year on with ` by now ` hundreds of complaints, and a saga with more hurdles, jumps and leaps of faith than, well, the Crusty Demons themselves. Here's Kaitlin. - KAITLIN: There's nothing to see here, but there's plenty left to say. - There'll be so many people in our position. It's just not fair, really. - If I was a person who took, like, everybody's money, there's no way in hell I'd get away with it. - The cancellation of the Crusty Demons motocross tour last year not only sucked, these families had spent hundreds of dollars on tickets. - I was working forward to the motorbikes, cos I'm quite into motorbikes. - Hayley had bought 10 tickets to take her son, Kieran, and his mates. - Was gonna go for my birthday, and I missed out twice. - I was just so, like, gutted that it wasn't happening. - They paid to see this... But almost all the profits went straight to the event promoter's bank account. Last year we introduced you to the man in charge of the New Zealand shows ` Matt Mahoney of Complete Events Group. At the time he told us ticket holders would be refunded in less than 45 business days. That was November, so... Yeah, the deadline's up on that. - Yeah, I'd been counting them. So they said business days, so that that worked out to be like nine weeks. And that took us up to, like, just before Christmas. - And then it just never came. - The ticketing agencies told customers they needed to contact Matt Mahoney's company to get their refunds. - And I emailed him like every week for like weeks` would be months, on end, and there was just no reply. Like, nothing at all. - One after another, ticketholders turned to Fair Go. All up, 500 of you contacted us having had no refunds, no answers. And finding those answers are at least a country away. There's the former event promoter Matt Mahoney, who we understand lives in Canberra. And then there are the other players in this, the founders of the Crusty Demons, Jon Freeman and Dana Nicholson, way out in California. - Welcome to our new podcast here. We got Bubba in the House, myself ` Dana Nicholson, Jon Freeman. - In our story last year, we looked at how these two parties split up, with the Crusty Demons claiming the shows hadn't been organised and deciding to hand their brand rights over to a different promoter. - Jon said they couldn't get hold of Matt to find out how many tickets had been sold, so in the end were forced to can the tour. Matt, on the other hand, argued he did have the shows ready and when he asked to hand details over to the new promoter, the Crusty Demons didn't respond. Since then, Matt's company, Complete Events Group, has been removed from the company's register, and he's still not taking our calls. But he did get our email and came back with this explanation as to why he hasn't given Kiwis their money back. He's waiting on the Crusty Demons to sign a bit of paper that, he says, will formally sever their relationship. - We ran this by a specialist civil litigation lawyer. - Well, a deed of release is a document that basically releases parties from obligations under an agreement or a contract. - Angela says she doesn't come across them then often. - I would have thought that this contract's already come to an end. So I'm wondering why he wants that deed of release. And it's probably so that he can be confident that there's not going to be any claims against him, but maybe he's just doing it just to be obstructive. I don't know. - Matt also said the responsibility of the tour was taken off him the day the Crusty Demons cut him out of the shows and brand, so in his eyes, he's actually off the hook. - But the terms and conditions on the tickets themselves show the contract was between the event promoter and ticketholder. - Well, the facts show that he's the one holding the money. So at the end of the day, that money has probably been taken by creditors as part of that receivership, unfortunately. - But then again, Angela says it's quite hard to trace where all the ticket money might have gone. So where does that leave ticketholders? - Unless they can somehow make a personal claim against him... But that's going to be really difficult, in New Zealand, to do that. You'd have to know where he lives, you'd have to somehow prove that he was the person that sold the ticket and that he has some sort of personal liability, not his company. It's very difficult. - Matt claims he paid a $400,000 licensing fee to the Crusty Demons, which they dispute, but wouldn't say whether they were in fact paid. The number of people ripped off doesn't stop at 500; tickets were bought on behalf of family and friends, sometimes big groups like the 13 going with Jonelle. So there'll be hundreds, if not thousands, more Kiwis out of pocket. So we put the names of every person we'd heard from into a document and sent them on to the public agency with the power to take action ` the Commerce Commission. But that was a dead-end too. A spokesperson telling us it still won't investigate. - But to these families, those words ring hollow. - Why? Why won't they do anything? Like, really? That just, um... makes me even more angry. - It's wrong, really. I mean, if anyone can help, it would be them. - The Commerce Commission, you know, they pick and choose. Their role is to regulate and to enforce consumer protection, but it doesn't involve necessarily getting refunds for people. - Which leaves one final and obvious seat to fill... The Crusty Demons themselves. Who, as it turns out, are about to perform a bunch of new shows and they're pretty close to home. - Yo, yo, yo, what's up? This is Bubba from the Crusty Demons. And guess what? We're coming back down under to Australia. - But don't expect free tickets. Do you feel like you have some obligation to your fans to take it on the chin, take the financial hit and do some shows in New Zealand? - So what have they been doing all this time to put things right? - Matt's saying, as long as he has a form signed, he'd release the money tomorrow. Is that even possible? Because if it were that simple, I mean, would you do it? - Well, that's a start. We've sent on Matt Mahoney's request to John and his legal team and are waiting to hear what they'll do next. But before putting the phone down, we had one more message to pass on. I had a mum contact me, and she said she feels like ` and these are her words, not mine ` that the Crusty Demons are quick to wash their hands, but they are the reason thousands of kids have lost hundreds of dollars. The Crusty Demons do not care about their fans here in NZ in the tiniest bit, and they've made that message clear. How do you feel, Jon, hearing that? - But the fans have had enough of the finger-pointing, Jonelle's pulling one of her own. - They're the ones doing the show. So I don't think it's right for them to put the 100% blame on the promoter. They need to own their stuff and front up and give everyone their money back because it's just not right. It's not fair. - Do you know what I feel like? Everyone's making the right sort of noises, but no one's actually` - Doing something. - ...coming up with any moolah. So Crusty Demons, Matt Mahoney ` you guys need to get it together and sort it out for the fans. - Yes, please. E haere ake nei, coming up ` they're a kitchen appliance some of us use every day... But what do we really know about using them safely? - The white bits round the handle and the centre of the mug, they're up there around 90 degrees. But it looks to me like it's hottest on the handle. - And Les put his trust in what looked like a Kiwi website... but wasn't. - It is based in Dunedin ` spent my money in New Zealand, that's why I went for that site. I've learnt the hard way. - Kia ora, nau mai, hoki mai ` welcome back. The next story is about diamonds ` not the big or expensive kind, but the sparkly kind indeed. The company behind them are not claiming they're selling real diamonds, but they are making promises. - Yeah, big promises that they are right here in Aotearoa, promises of quality, promises of delivery... And then... nothing. Gill's been busy finding out who's behind this diamond heist. - # Lucy in the sky with diamonds. # - GILL: How's this for adding a sparkle to your day? - # ...sky with diamonds. # - I have my little radio on, listening to all the '60s and '70s music, and I do these diamond dots. - It's a craft called diamond painting. - Bit by bit, hour by hour. And the diamond dots are in different shades of light glitter. - Des finds it's good for the soul, but recently, not for the pocket. - I think to myself, Gill, it's $100. I have been let down wholeheartedly by this company - And so have heaps of others, complaining to us and... complaining on Facebook. - They all thought diamond-painting.co.nz was a Kiwi company they could trust. - It is based in Dunedin ` spent my money in New Zealand, that's why I went for that site. - Des also likes a challenge. - This bigger one here has got 27,000... - Oh, ho! ...diamond dots on it, - And this site offered the biggest canvases he'd ever seen. - More diamond dots, more time, better picture on the wall. - So in went Des' order for this extra-wide capital special. Now orders like this one, from other Kiwi sites, would arrive in a few days. But with the new website... - They say 10 to 20 business days for delivery. Those days went past ` nothing. - So Des' wife Margaret had time to knit up a storm while Des had to wait, emailing again and again. - They say their support network is there to help their customers. - An incredible level of help, even protecting against missing diamonds. But Des' whole order is missing. - It is 12 weeks tomorrow since I ordered that painting. - # We're caught in a trap... # - We talked to Netsafe for an idea of what's been going on. - It's very easy for any one of us to set up a website that looks like this, that looks good. - The fact there's a physical address in Dunedin suggests it could be a drop-shipping site ` just an office ` as the site states it gets its products sent from China. - They don't have stock; it's not like they've got a warehouse somewhere of their own. They go straight to the manufacturer and say, 'Please send this to my customer.' - It's a pretty common practice these days, and the site says all the right things to be reassuring... - # ...with suspicious minds. # - And look at even the detail ` 'We are expert crafters ourselves (particularly adore cross-stitching!)' - It starts to smell like ChatGPT wrote the words on your website. - Would you say it's a scam or just a bit useless? - People are ordering from a very legitimate-looking website and nothing arrives. To me that's a drop-shipping scam. - It's hard for Des to get his head round. He's from a time when you could pay �10 to move to New Zealand... - I actually came here to play football ` Wellington City in those days and then Miramar Rangers. - ...and you got dressed up to fly. - I had my Elton John shoes with heels ` heels on them. - So the Internet? - I'm an ordinary bloke, you know, I was not brought up with computers at my age. - So if there's an address, he expects an office. - I mean, I don't know, Gill, but there must be a representative, I would have thought, in New Zealand for that company. Am I right or am I wrong? - Well, here's the building... But sorry, Des, the only craft here takes place under a bonnet. The owner deals in cars and bikes, mostly classics, so some are gems, but no diamonds used for painting. It's definitely not you ` it's not a little side hustle? - Positive. (LAUGHS) - Still, he's heard of the company... Too often. - We've had a couple of people come in asking, looking for art supplies. - Yeah. - And where their order is. Yeah, now you see people walk through the gate and you can tell, pretty quickly, what they're here for. - Des is disappointed. - That's why I went there, Gill, to spend my money within New Zealand. And you're now telling me it doesn't exist. - Lots of people get fooled. A genuine Kiwi diamond-painting supplier agrees. - It just doesn't seem right because people think they're in New Zealand. - Because, as she found out... - Anyone in the whole world ` doesn't matter where they are ` can operate a .co.nz website. - She's diamondpainting.co.nz without a dash, and was doing just fine till this cut-price competitor turned up. - My sales completely dried up. I used to send maybe 5 to 10 orders out a day, and it got to the stage where I was sending maybe one a week, and just fielding non-stop phone calls, emails, messages from people ` 'Where's my order?' Got to the stage I didn't even want to answer my phone anymore. - What's happened with your business now? - I've closed. - We checked out the domain name and her competitor is Russian Oleg Frizen, but what is he up to? All the posts on the very active Facebook page came to an end in June last year. Now it's just used for customer complaints. And stranger still, one customer has told us that they did receive a response after sending 30 emails. And that was from Jennifer Jackson, 'Support Agent #1', and she got her product ` well, half of it. So it's all unclear and we have tried to get an explanation for weeks, but like most of his customers, we've come away empty-handed. - # Shine bright like a diamond. # - So don't be dazzled by websites with diamond deals. - And it's not always the kind of 99%-off kind of offer, but even just a little bit less than everybody's selling. Why? How are they able to sell it for that price? - And check before you buy. - The quickest way to tell would be Googling the name of that company and putting the word 'scam' after it. - # We're like diamonds in the sky. # - I've learned the hard way. - But at least he's used his misfortune to shine a light on what's been going on. - # Shine bright like a diamond. # - They are very cool pieces of art, aren't they? It is weird that most customers are hearing nothing at all, maybe you do need to send 30 emails to get noticed. - E haere ake nei, coming up ` Garth has a painful experience. - This is a lesson from personal experience... - (WHIMPERS) Ow! (BEEP) - And goes on a hunt for answers. - I'll send you this cup over. Would you mind? It's on it's way. - Kia ora, nau mai, hoki mai ` welcome back. Thanks for having us at your house. Love the new curtains. Now, our inbox is always full of stories you send us ` issues, challenges and some funny stuff too. But it is a little unusual when a story starts with something that happened, well, to Garth. - Mm-hmm, yes ` he had a wee accident. And, along with the pain and the gentle whimpering, there was talk about wave-lengths and water molecules and microwave ovens. Probably best if Garth explains. - 'Microwave safe' ` what even is that? And if it doesn't say that on the cup, bowl or container, what could that mean? This is a lesson from personal experience. (GROANS, WHIMPERS) (BLEEP, BLEEP) First thing is first aid ` 20 minutes under cold, running water. Plenty of time to ponder. I nuked this mug to make a milky coffee and it made the handle too hot to handle ` like, hotter than the cup or anything that was inside it. It was a mug from the work kitchen, one I'd never used before. Puzzling. Time for some one-handed research. Hi, Geoff. Can you help me out with this one? Geoff Willmott is a physicist. I'll send you this cup over. Would you mind? It's on its way. Geoff knows a lot about microwaves. - Yeah, so microwaves are a form of electromagnetic radiation. So we've got a whole lot of, basically, light waves bouncing around inside the microwave. And they're at the right wavelength that they like to heat up water molecules, in particular. So that's what we're doing with the microwave oven is heating up all the water molecules in your food. - off checks that with a thermal imaging camera. - The white bits ` so around the handle and the centre of the mug ` they're up there around 90 degrees. But it looks to me like it's hottest on the handle. - Compare that with his trusty cuppa. - You can see how the handle is kept much cooler. - So why did mine fail? Two theories. - Firstly, it was poor materials and poor design of the mug in the first place, so that the handle heated up ` it was directly heated. And the second is that the glazing has failed, and so the water has got into the porous interior and heated up the handle that way. - So what about microwave safe? I mean, I just thought that meant it wouldn't wreck the pattern or that it wouldn't blow up in the microwave. - Manufacturers of some plastics will put microwave safe on their cookware to show that it won't leach into your food. - Right. - Most glass or ceramics are pretty much microwave safe on the on the face of it. But it seems like we've found a little gap in that armour here. - Yeah well, no wonder I burnt my finger, right? OK. Hey, thanks very much. You can keep the cup ` just don't nuke it. I'm feeling foolish. Another 17 minutes should do it. But am I alone? - You're not alone. - Ah, James. - ACC supports around 400 people to recover from a microwave-related injury each year. Most of those injuries are actually like soft tissue injuries, so sprains and strains, probably linked to dropping it or holding it in an awkward way and moving. The next most common injury is burns. - That costs ACC nearly $5000,000 a year. And for every microwave oven mishap in a workplace, there are 10 in a home. - When you're at home, you drop your guard a fair bit more than you do when you're at work. And some things, like safety, kind of get forgotten about. - So what can people do? - If you're at home and you want to avoid injury, just slow down a little bit. Think of the risks, make smart choices and you'll be sweet. - Yeah, trying to prevent injuries sure beats fixing them after. Another 15 minutes should do it. - The humble microwave. Where do you put the humble microwave? Ours it too high, so your kind of up like this, trying to get across the kitchen with the old reheat. - Mm. - Very difficult. - You know when you take it out you can actually lower it as well? - No, I run across like this. This is much easier. - Right that's it from us. But if you only caught part of the show, you can catch all of it ` plus past episode on the Fair Go page on TVNZ+ whenever you want, because we're always here to help. - Our programme ` all about you at home, your consumer aches and pains. You've got issues ` we know it. Come and see us ` huge, teeny-tiny, we've got your back. Keep in touch. Please give your contact phone number, very important. - That's right. We're on Facebook, TikTok and Instagram. You can go to our webpage ` Email us ` Or write to us ` - Love a good letter. Thank you for watching. Until next week` I've got to go ` I've got something in the microwave. - Oh, bless. Po marie.