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Nigel Latta Killing Our Kids

ChannelTV One
Date Broadcast Tuesday 19 August 2014
Start Time19 : 30
Finish Time20 : 30
Duration60:00
Series1
Episode4

Why are New Zealand's rates of family violence so high? This episode delves into the factors influencing our domestic violence rates and meets some of the people working towards making our communities safer.

Clinical psychologist Nigel Latta sets out on a journey to sort fact from spin, and get to the core of the major social issues facing New Zealanders.

Full record
Captions

(clicks button) DON'T MIND ME. (horn honks) (footsteps approaching) LET ME SPEAK TO HIM. WHAT'S GOING ON? WHAT ARE YOU DOING HERE? YOU HIT THE NAIL ON THE HEAD, BOB. ABOUT WHAT? THERE IS A POWERFUL ORGANIZATION WITHIN LAW ENFORCEMENT. BUT IT'S A LOT BIGGER THAN YOU THOUGHT. IT'S NOT JUST THE BIG BOYS, EITHER. THEY EVEN LET LOWER LEVEL GUYS LIKE ME IN. I KNOW WHAT YOU'RE DOING. WE'VE HAD OUR EYE ON YOU FOR A LONG TIME. WE JUST WANT TO HELP. IT'S WHAT WE DO. HELP ME HOW? LISTEN TO ME CLOSELY. THAT'S THE ADDRESS OF A SAFE HOUSE. IT'S 2 MILES DUE EAST OF HERE. WHEN YOU GET THERE, SOMEONE WILL CONTACT YOU, GET YOU SOME MONEY, I.D., CLOTHES. (crumpling card) I DON'T BELIEVE YOU. (sighs) COME ON, BOB. GET OUT OF THE VAN. (chains rattling) START RUNNING. JUST DO IT HERE. ACTUALLY, I'D PREFER IT IF YOU RAN. YOU KNOW... PROTOCOL. (chains rattling) (gunshots) AGENT KIRKLAND TRIED TO ESCAPE. YOU HAD NO CHOICE BUT TO USE DEADLY FORCE. DO YOU UNDERSTAND? TIGER TIGER. TIGER TIGER. 1 PENSIVE MUSIC MACHINE WHIRRS HAUNTING MUSIC When I grew up, NZ was a country famous for being a great place to raise kids. But you can't pick up a newspaper in NZ these days without reading yet another story of horrific child abuse and neglect. And it seems like it's getting worse. I was appalled to read a recent news item that the number of NZ babies dying from deliberate head injuries has quadrupled in the last 20 years. So what's going wrong? This is a subject I know something about. I worked here in South Auckland as a psychologist for the better part of two decades. I've seen this stuff up close and personal. I've seen dead kids, and I've worked with the people who kill them. Child abuse isn't a highly visible crime. It happens in secret behind closed doors. But what really winds me up is that the cause is no great mystery. I want to take you into this world ` behind all those doors and windows, behind the statistics and politics ` and show you why NZ kills so many children, and what we can and should do to stop it. Captions were made possible with funding from NZ On Air. Copyright Able 2014 Child, Youth and Family speaking. How can I help you? Yep. No, that's fine. What was the baby's name? Child, Youth and Family are the department which is usually criticised when a child is injured or killed. Have you seen any violence? Was that verbal or physical? They work with this country's most vulnerable children ` the kids at the greatest risk of abuse or have been hurt. I see you're ringing here about a 3-year-old child. It's easy to criticise, but most people don't have a clue about the scale of the problem they deal with. Here at the National Contact Centre, they receive up to 3000 calls a day. And around 300 of those calls are directly about concerns for children's safety. Broken rib and now an arm. These are appalling statistics. And the worst cases end up here ` the accident and emergency department. Every year, police arrest over 1500 adults for assaulting children, and on average, one child dies every three and a half weeks. HAUNTING MUSIC Dr Russell Wills is someone who deals with the reality of those huge numbers. He's a paediatrician at Hawke's Bay Hospital working on the front line. It's OK. It's OK. In 2011, because of his unfortunate expertise in this area, he was appointed Children's Commissioner. Of my workload, originally it was probably three-quarters autism and ADHD. And these days it would be two-thirds foetal alcohol spectrum disorder, and abuse. If you look at the kind of the picture of child abuse and neglect in this country, is your sense that it's getting worse? So, overall crime is falling, but violent crime, and particularly crimes against children ` so assaults against children ` have gone up. And a lot of those are really severe assaults. I don't know what's driving that, but it appears to have increased in the last decade. And it worries me enormously. Wills has good reason to worry. NZ has the second-highest rate of child homicide in the world. We're double Australia and three times the UK. We kill at six times the rate they do in Italy. These are horrific statistics by any standard, but I think we're looking at the problem the wrong way. One of the things that frustrates me about this issue is that we focus so much on the high-profile cases of child homicide. The truth is that they're just one part of a much greater problem. And that problem is violence in our homes. The dead children we read about are a highly visible tip of a greater iceberg of domestic violence. NZ has appalling rates of family violence. And that's the real issue. If you want to know just how big NZ's domestic violence problem is, then ask the people who are first in the door. Approximately 90,000 reports of family violence we attend every year. So if you break that down, that's one incident every six minutes the NZ police are attending. And if you also factor in that the experts tell us that about 20% of the incidents of family violence is actually reported to us, that does put it in perspective. So the actual number of real incidents out there is huge. Absolutely. It could be five times 90,000 a year. That's huge. Around 450,000 incidents a year, and 60% of them involving children. Violence has been part of Vic Tamati's life for as long as he can remember. I ended up bashing up my 8-year-old baby. Told her to get up and go to school, and, uh, she said no. I said to her, 'Get up and fucking get ready. Go to school'. And she just staunched up and she went, 'No'. And I looked around the lounge and I see a shoe. And I grabbed the shoe and I beated her with the shoe. And, uh, she's still trying to staunch up. So I turned the shoe around and I... smashed her with the heel of the shoe. And it was, uh,... It was a platform shoe, you know? I was like, 'Do what I say.' You know? 'Get up and go to school, like I said. 'Don't... Don't tell me no.' And I just put her to bed, and my wife came home, and I told her that I'd given her a hiding. She went in the bedroom, saw what I had done, the damage I'd done and just went crazy, went ape shit. Said she was leaving me, she's taking the kids, and that before they leave, they wanted to talk to me. And in my head was, 'And as soon as you all finish talking, I'm going to take you all out'. Nobody leaves me. We'll see who leaves. ATMOSPHERIC ELECTRONIC MUSIC Child abuse is just part of a much larger problem of family violence, which is a huge issue in this country. This is Flaxmere. At first glance it's a fairly innocuous small town. But it's a notorious hotspot for family violence and child abuse. Flaxmere also has the unfortunate distinction of having some of the highest rates of drug abuse and crime in the region. But it wasn't always like this. GENTLE PIANO MUSIC Flaxmere was originally developed in the '60s as a show-home community ` an ideal place to raise kids. So what went wrong? How are you? How are you, brother? How are you? How are you, brother? Henare. How are you? How are you? How are you, brother? Henare. How are you? Good to see ya, mate. Henare O'Keefe is typical of the people living here in Flaxmere. He moved here with his family to work in the local freezing works. Back then, the works anchored the entire community, providing jobs and security for local families. 23 years in the freezing works. What a learning that was. It was more than a freezing works. It was a lifestyle, it was a constitution, it was a family. But in 1994, all that ended. Changes in the economy closed the works. It turned this community and the surrounding district upside down. You know, uh, that's all we knew. It was a horrific time of our lives. Just fearful, angry, frustrated. Families struggled to make ends meet, and for some families it proved too much. They fractured under the pressure. In a short time, Flaxmere went from a model suburb to having some of the highest crime rates in the area. Flaxmere developed gang and alcohol and drug problems, and a growing problem with family violence. OMINOUS MUSIC Russell Wills sees this first hand every day. As well as being Children's Commissioner, he's a paediatrician working on the front line in Hawke's Bay Hospital. He's certain a decline in the town's economy has had a huge effect on families. Nearly all the kids I see are from families` who have been abused are from families who are dirt poor. Really poor. They haven't got the money to put food on the table three times a day, seven days a week. At a national level, what role does poverty play in child abuse and neglect in this country? We know from good data that we've got very high rates of, uh, death at the hands of family, and assault leading to admission. So we know that. Um, it's very strongly related to poverty. Admission to hospital is 10 times more common in the poorest 10% of the population than the wealthiest 10%. And not just` not just financial poverty, but the poverty of spirit. Russell Wills isn't the only one to notice this. Scientific study after study after study tells us that poverty plays a huge part in the breakdown of a community and leads to an increase in domestic violence. It's also often combined with another factor. We're seeing a lot of kids with foetal alcohol effects. Um, and I guess we know looking at crime data that there's a lot more young women drinking heavily and getting in trouble with the law. And, you know, some really damaged kids from alcohol. And it's not just developing brains that are affected. Alcohol damages families and communities. It's the petrol that keeps the engines running. As long as we have alcohol flowing in abundance, to earliest hours of the morning, and cheap ` cheaper than water, in some instances ` and it's accessible ` easily accessible as it is ` um, you're going to be pushing the proverbial uphill. SHOUTING, SIREN WAILS And it isn't just Flaxmere. The pattern of poverty, alcohol and family violence is repeated around the country. RAISED VOICES, DOG BARKS Here in South Auckland, James and Desiree are struggling financially. They have two kids. They don't have enough money to afford to buy a house, or even to rent a home of their own. They share a house with other family members. They both have a problem with alcohol, and it's led to violence, trouble with the police, and now a referral to Child, Youth and Family. JAMES: Well, first I... got a little bit physical to her. When you say, like, 'A little bit physical', was there a single event or was it a slow build-up of things? Um, yeah, there was one event that made a change for me, cos the police got involved while me and her were having a confrontation. Um, that was when I held her throat. Left quite big bruise marks on her neck. And my brother had to pretty much grab me and tell me to stop it. And did the kids see it? And did the kids see it? They actually woke up. They actually woke up and saw... saw what we were doing. I would've been in prison. Child, Youth and Family are now involved. They're concerned that what's going on is a danger to the children. A lot of people would say, you know, 'Just kick him out'. Like, 'You should just leave him'. But you didn't do that. You thought you'd stay together. How come? Why? Um, because I love him. And, you know, I knew that we could change. But it's going to take more than just love. Unless something changes, James' and Desiree's children are at risk, especially if the behaviour escalates. DOORBELL BUZZES Family violence is a huge problem in NZ. I wanted to give you a taste of what it's like being the ambulance at the bottom of the cliff trying to fix the problem. I'm here at the Child, Youth and Family, or CYFs, office in Manurewa to meet social workers who have to deal with child abuse and neglect cases everyday. Carol. Carol. Hey, Nigel. How are you? Carol. Hey, Nigel. How are you? Very good. How are you? Carole Joseph has worked at CYFs for over 25 years, and she's seen just about everything you could imagine, and a bunch of things you probably couldn't. They're all dealing with the same stuff. There's phone calls, and there's kids in rooms. It's like ER. Busy busy. But that's part of what we do. We've actually got a critical that's come in this morning, Nigel. It's a little 18-month-old boy who has got a skull fracture. Do the family have history? Do they have family violence stuff? There's a little bit of history. There's a little bit of history. Was that the dad? Was that him towards mum? Yes, it was. It was the parents' relationship. A lot of people would say, 'Just go and take the kid', wouldn't they? 'Just go and take the kid`' Well, we might still do that. This is typical? You arrive at the office, first thing is an 18-month-old with a skull fracture? At the moment, Carole's dealing with 25 different families ` every one of them with multiple and often horrendous problems. It's up to her and her colleagues at CYFs to come up with a solution for all of them, often picking the least worse from a selection of pretty bad options. Sometimes this involves the traumatic process of removing children from their families. ...had a call from the contact centre and we've got a critical. Just in the short time I spent with Carole, there were plenty of tough decisions to be made. That child is at risk, so I would be inclined to be in there all the time. From potentially abused kids... From potentially abused kids... When is baby due? From potentially abused kids... When is baby due? Two weeks' time. ...to a pregnant 12-year-old whose parents are heavy drinkers and don't seem to think there's anything that they should be concerned about. And in fact, in my first home visit, Dad made the comment that she was over at her in-laws'. She's 12 and she's over at the in-laws? She's 12 and she's over at the in-laws? It raised some major alarm bells. > Blimmin' heck. This stuff never fails to amaze me. And this is just one morning's work in one Child, Youth and Family office. Over the course of a year, CYFs deal with over 60,000 notifications of family violence, and 20,000 of those involve child abuse and neglect. It's hard to get your head around those statistics, but they're real families and real children. REFLECTIVE MUSIC Briar and Linda are from Te Whanau Tahi, an agency working for Child, Youth and Family here in South Auckland. They're following up on reports of domestic violence. We don't believe in a letter or a phone call or anything where mum can say to us, 'No, I'm good as gold', and she's sitting at the other end of the phone with a couple of black eyes. So we visit them in their homes. KNOCK ON THE DOOR Hello? I'm Linda, from Te Whanau Tahi. I'm a social worker. I'm just looking for <BLEEP>. I'm just` Yeah, just making sure that, um, <BLEEP>'s all right, really. There was a bit of an incident, or something. Every day that you go out, you could be getting anything, you know? We've gone to do a home visit with a couple and they're in the middle of a domestic scene. And you're ringing police and trying to get them apart. Briar and Linda know what they're talking about. They've both come from abusive relationships, so they know this stuff personally and professionally. Plus they have street cred, which apparently, I don't. So what will happen if you just wandered down the street? Would people come up and accost you? Yep. Yep. Yeah. Yep. Yeah. Would you get smacked over? Possibly. Possibly. Mm. Possibly. Mm. Particularly you. (LAUGHS) There's a lot of poverty out here. You go into homes ` ice cubes in the fridge, no food there. And the children are made to sleep. They're put to sleep` Mm. Mm. ...if they're hungry, aren't they? A lot of families. Yup. Yup. But, yes, there is definitely poverty here in South Auckland. DOG BARKS DOG BARKS (CALLS OUT) Oh, he's a big boy all right. Oh, he's a big boy all right. Jesus. That's a really big dog. > He wants to kill us, doesn't he? He wants to kill us, doesn't he? Yeah, he does. You look tasty. Did you get this? < Amazing, eh? So part of what you're doing is just having a look around. And part of it is, 'What's in the wheelie bin?' Because that's a pretty good picture of where things are up to, isn't it? where things are up to, isn't it? Exactly. Well, that's part of the picture, yeah. Cos that's at least two 18 packs of 8% Cody's. > Yeah. > SIRENS WAIL Linda and Briar believe in one-on-one contact in people's homes. Who did he threaten to kill? Who did he threaten to kill? Uh,... one of his ex-partners. And they're prepared to work with anyone who's willing,... How's it going? ...including this guy, who's on electronic bail with a record of violence and substance abuse so big, it's scared other agencies away. Like, did you drink a lot, or not much, or...? > It'd be easier to name what I didn't do. There weren't other agencies who were happy to come out and have a chat? > And that's when you guys came in. > These are the first ones that have come here. The rest have declined to even leave their offices. How much difference does it have having Linda and Briar coming in and`? > Oh, massive difference. Like I say, um, if you ask them, like I said, about a month ago I... I was pretty much a shell of a guy. They can make these changes, and we awhi them and support them all the way. We make sure` We'll go that extra mile... Mm. Mm. ...with these whanau so that they'll do what they've set out to do. This stuff actually works. These are no-nonsense women making a real difference. What sort of percentage of cases do you get where there are no more domestic violence notifications, or, um, Child, Youth and Family involvement? Where they close the file? I would say... between 60-70%. That's` That's pretty impressive. Is it? Is it? Yeah. (LAUGHS) Yes. That's quite impressive given the families that you guys are working with. That's really impressive. I've done this a long time. And trust me ` those are amazing results. The problem is that CYFs are overwhelmed with these families, and there aren't enough Linda and Briars out there. Do you ever get angry and feel like going to Wellington and saying, 'What the hell are you people doing'? 'What the hell are you people doing'? Don't have the time. (LAUGHS) Actually, yes. Yes. Last visit of the morning is James and Desiree. How are you? How are you? Morning, Desiree, James. > They're on Te Whanau Tahi's books because of their history of domestic violence. So, how's the alcohol been going? Nothing like we used to. Yup? Yup? We still have our odd drinks, but, um, listen to your advice, you know? Try and keep it just to a moderate drink. Yep. And it took us a while to work out what you meant by a good drink and a good drink. And a good drink was a couple, and a good drink was a box. Yeah? Yep. Yep. And how that kind of affected the relationship, and all the stuff that was being buried underneath was then coming to the top. Briar and Linda don't expect to be dealing with angels, and they understand that people slip sometimes. But when it comes to children's safety, they take a hard line. We're really clear. From that first home visit, we're there to support you. But as soon as we have any indication that there are care and protection concerns for children, Child, Youth and Family will be notified. And we don't do a visit and do, 'How are you today?' ` the nice stuff ` and then go out the door and make the phone call. That family knows what we're gonna do before we leave that property. ARGUING, CHILD CRYING Child abuse and family violence is a mostly hidden crime, and it goes on inside homes, behind closed doors. But it happens because a community tolerates it. How do you fix that? Henare O'Keefe decided to try. In 2008 Henare organised a march to protest against the growing levels of violence in his town. 3000 residents from Flaxmere and the surrounding areas joined him. They all came together and with one voice trumpeted aloud, 'Enough is enough. We're taking our community back'. THUMP! It genuinely lifted my heart to see what they were doing with these kids. It might look old-fashioned, but it's bloody clever. Henare set up a gym for local kids. Boxing's the drawcard which pulls them in, but it's not about fighting; it's about learning to work together, respect, and looking after each other. Try the other way. Try the other way. BOYS LAUGH The thing, like, you wanna get these guys, you wanna get them young and... ...get them involved. Pull them in. That's how you make changes ` by association, not ostracising them. Get that hand across. Get that hand across. This stuff works on attitudes and values. It gets under the skin, and the psychologist in me knows that's the secret to changing behaviour. Hey, guys, just remember our message for this term, around our sponsors. Who's our main sponsor? Boys: Our parents. Boys: Our parents. Our parents. Fantastic. All right. So how do we treat our sponsors? If we want our sponsors to continue to treat us well? Show them love with action. Show them love with action. < With actions. That's right. I love the fact that Henare's schemes are elegantly practical. Every strategy is about building bridges into previously closed families. A brilliant example is the Te Aranga Marae community garden, which is open to everyone. Not only will it feed the populace, but it will also bring everybody together. That's what it's done. Do people come in here and take stuff? The community are involved in growing it, aren't they? Yeah, no` all and sundry, really. All races, creeds and colours. The garden has no respect to persons. If you have a need, if you need to be sustained in terms of vegetables, etc ` cos we know how expensive they are ` uh, well, here's the place to do that. This is quite simply genius. < It's very cabbage-y, isn't it? The garden does far more than just feed local families; it brings people together. It builds trust and cooperation. He's rebuilding fractured communities literally from the ground up. And guess what? No government intervention. (LAUGHS) Comes straight from where the rubber meets the road. It's unbelievable. So you didn't apply for government funding? So you didn't apply for government funding? No. We just got on with it. (LAUGHS) When you look at the numbers and statistics, Maori and Pasifika are over-represented in terms of the stats for child abuse, neglect and a bunch of bad stuff. But why do you think that is? You could throw colonisation in there; you could throw poverty in there, which is, um,... You could throw prison in there, where we make up far too much of the populace. You could throw all of those things in there. But is it really a cultural thing? Or is it just, 'You made these kids. You look after them'. Put a roof over their head, put clothes on their backs. Fix the home, you fix the community. Once this country gets that right, we will truly begin to move forward. Is that all right? Is that all right? Yeah. Is that all right? Yeah. OK. Good. Tunutunu is another of Henare's pet projects. It's a massive mobile BBQ that regularly tours the streets of Flaxmere giving away free sausages by the hundred. This is like barbecuing on an industrial scale, eh? Oh, mate. Oh, mate. Fantastic. It's free food, but that's not the point here. Henare's BBQ is another way of getting into the community, opening those closed doors and making contact with families who feel isolated or afraid. One of those. Good man. I have various agencies there. I have the police there, the dentist, doctors. And so, um, when they come out, then you can begin to minister to them, you know? Talk to them informally, empathetically. We've been able to fix up problems right there in their own backyard. It's also an effective way for frightened women and children to reach out and get help immediately. People ring that number from their lounge window, and they've been able to get help for the violence that has been perpetrated in that home. This is a mobile BBQ, and you save lives because you're in there and they talk to you and they ring up. That's an incredible thing. It's the bridge that people walk across from their hearts to ours. You inspire people. You're around youth for about a minute and a half, and you think, 'OK, what can I do?' (LAUGHS) (LAUGHS) That's what you do to people. (LAUGHS) That's what you do to people. That's lovely to hear that, Nigel. It's one thing to inspire a community, but how do you help violent individuals? MAN: Programme content ` recognises the different levels of anger and therefore has established alternative ways to cope with anger without resorting to physical and or verbal violence. I went along to a group run by Briar and Linda for men who've been violent to their partners or children but who want to change. I'd like to really congratulate you men. That was a huge amount of courage to walk in that door and be a part of this programme, because it's domestic violence. Linda and Briar have persuaded James to attend the group and to deal with his own violent behaviour. Kia ora, guys, my name's James. I don't want that any more, eh. I want to pretty much break the cycle, really, that's just been passed on through my family. And I just want to break the cycle. James' story is all too familiar to anyone working in this field. Nearly ready. It's something we see all the time in the upbringing of violent adults. Wanna get some toys? Eh? Wanna get some toys you can play with? If you actually look back, albeit nine times out of 10, he was a victim. You know? And the victim... generational victim. Was violence a part of your, kind of, background in your childhood and things growing up? I seen it throughout my whole grown-up life, with my mum. It wasn't really with anyone else, just my mum's boyfriends she had... I used to see her get beat by them. Well, in my family that's how they solved it. Just by getting violent. When I was young, back then, it was scary for me. I used to get scared a lot. Just want to go hide in my room. When did all the, kind of`? When did the violence stuff start in your life? Oh, when I was young. At home, at school, church, Sunday school. Getting beaten up at home by Dad. Um, getting yelled at and called names by my mum. People still don't believe me, but, um, you know, getting a hiding with a machete. And, uh, I'm scared that this machete is coming this way, you know? And it's gonna take off my head or my arms or my legs, you know? But he always hit me with the flat of the blade. When did you start to think that it wasn't normal? When did your view of the world start to change? I ended up smashing a guy's face with a broken glass. And, uh, all the people at the pub eventually kicked my head in. Popped my eye out, cut my head. And I went to the hospital, and, um, when I got home, my dad opened the door, saw me, he reached out and grabbed the bandage off my eye, and just ripped it off. Pulled my eye back out. I fainted on the ground. And, um, when I came to, it was because my dad was on the top of me, just pummelling me, smashing me. All I could think of was, um, 'My dad really loves me', cos that's what he used to say every time he-he-he-he beat me up... was that he did this to me because he loved me. He'd say, 'This is my love for you. This is my love to you, and that this love comes from God'. Why do you think your dad did that? He really cared and wanted me to get the best possible start... of life in this country than what he had. And so he thought the way to get you the best was to be really strict and to show you right from wrong, and the best way to do that was to beat you when you did wrong. and the best way to do that was to beat you when you did wrong. Yeah, and toughen me up. Your dad did what he thought was best in raising you. He was wrong. But he did what he thought was best. And you did what little kids do, which is you look to your dad, that you love, and you take on board these messages of how to be a man and how to treat people. And so then you just roll out into the world with that stuff. Kids are looking for a way to be. And everybody said to you, 'This is the way to be. People give you shit, smack them. 'People break a rule, smack them one. If you do that, that's how you protect your family, 'that's good with God, that's good with everybody.' Everyone lied to me. Every single man that I knew growing up all lied to me. This is not what it means to be a man. You know? My mum didn't want me to try and kill her. My 8-year-old daughter didn't want me to bash her up. My wife didn't want me to... you know, rip her clothes off and smash her into the door. They never wanted that. You know? But I didn't know any better. (INHALES) < It's all right. PENSIVE MUSIC I've spent 20 years working with troubled families. All the research, and everyone dealing with this stuff first-hand, agrees that child abuse and domestic violence are driven by poverty, alcohol and drugs, and poor parenting. Do something about those and you start to fix the problem in the long-term. But governments never seem to tackle those issues head-on. I don't want to get into a debate about current party policies, but I was interested in a politician's perspective. Michael Cullen was associate minister of finance during the huge social reforms of the Rogernomics era in the 1980s. I asked him why politicians have historically been so rubbish at making policies for the long-term. I think the problem is that politicians can't worry about whether someone in 30 years' time is going to judge that they've done the right thing. There's an election coming up in one or two years. And how's this going to run over that period of time? That makes long-term issues like healthcare and superannuation and so on particularly difficult issues to discuss. What I've seen sometimes is that there's something about working as part of that Wellington bureaucracy that makes people think they know more than others. I was in a meeting with clinicians who collectively had spent over a hundred years working on this particular issue. And someone from some ministry of something-or-other was telling us why we were completely wrong, and we need to do it this way. I think that attitude has been greatly exacerbated ` I think it's getting a bit better in more recent years ` um, by the dominant theories, the public-choice theory and all of this, in the '80s and early '90s, which said, 'You can't have provider capture. 'Everybody is self-interested. Doctors are interested in how they can promote their own careers,' etc. And it was almost a given that within the health administration that clinicians should be ignored. They had nothing to offer in terms of how you ran the system. So bureaucrats in Wellington thought they shouldn't listen to people on the front line, because we were only interested in furthering our own careers. Well, I think they should listen a bit more to people with first-hand experience. You wanna know how to burglar-proof your home, well, it makes sense to get a burglar up there. You know? (LAUGHS) I don't know, it just makes sense to me. If you wanna know how to` how do you` how you stop a man from beating his wife up, well, talk to a man who used to do it. James is one of those men. Eight weeks after attending his first stopping-violence group, he's now successfully completed the programme. APPLAUSE LINDA: It's just awesome to see all of youse graduate. Now, I've worked alongside quite a few gentlemen in the group, and I've seen the changes in them. So congratulations to you all. I love it, love it. Kia ora, bro. I'd like to thank the bros for the journey. Learned how to recognise and deal with my anger issues in other ways. Non-violent. I've just gotta say, I'm living a happier life than I was. And, uh, hope it gets better. Thank you, guys. TENSE MUSIC Violence has been a part of Vic Tamati's life since he was a child. It affected his entire world view. He was both a victim and a perpetrator of violence until the day his family stood up and said enough was enough. The first one to speak was my 8-year-old daughter. And she said it was all her fault. She said, 'It's all because of me, Daddy.' Couldn't understand that. How could an 8-year-old, who I'd beaten up, take the blame for what I did? Not one time when my dad was beating up me up did I ever think it was my fault. And here was my baby covering up for me. Early in the next morning I made a promise that I'd go and do something. I ended up ringing up the Stopping Violence programme in Christchurch, where we live. And, um, did the interviews, signed up, rolled in. Vic managed to confront his demons and eventually turned his life around. SCATTERED APPLAUSE He now works to raise awareness amongst other men. Hey, everybody. You guys all good? I went to one of his meetings at a local football club to see exactly how he does that. And I wasn't prepared at all for what I saw. Um, I'm going to do an exercise with us all. I call it the roll call. I ask these questions of what I've done. And if you've done it, I'm asking you to stand. You know? 'Please stand'. If along your journey and you've perpetrated violence on a member of your family, assaulted a member of your family ` if that's you, can you please stand. If along that journey, and in your relationships, and you had children, and you physically abused those children ` if that's you, can you please stand. If on your journey, and you are responsible for the death of a member of the public, either accidentally or intentionally ` if that's you, can you please stand. But as Vic made his extraordinary confessions, something amazing happened. Something I've never seen happen before in groups like this. If on your journey, and you perpetrated violence on a member of the public ` if that's you, can you please stand. Men began to stand up. They began to share their own experiences of violence. You were beaten up by someone older, bigger. Mum, dad, uncle, auntie ` if that's you, can you please stand. I say to them, you know, like, 'All that stuff that happened to you as a kid, that's not your fault. 'You're not supposed to have been raised like that, you know, with all the violence'. Then I challenge them and I say, 'Today you have to take responsibility for all that now. 'You got no choice, cos you've been here, and you've heard this'. Can you please stand. PENSIVE STRINGS MUSIC A lot of people roll their eyes when you talk about this stuff, cos they think people who beat their partners, or who beat their kids, are just bad parents, and, partly, that's true. They are. But they're not just evil monsters. If there's one thing that you get from this programme, it's that it's not as simple as that. If I'd lived Vic's life, or James' life, if I'd grown up amongst all of that substance abuse, and poverty, and violence, then I probably would have been a pretty shit parent as well. I'm not saying there's some magical solution out there. But there's definitely lots we can do, and some people are. As a country, we need to tackle the big issues of poverty and alcohol, and we need to stamp out family violence. And most of all, we need to make sure our politicians stay focused on long-term solutions that actually work. We can fix this problem. Captions by Shelley Upchurch. Edited by Jessica Boell. www.able.co.nz Captions were made possible with funding from NZ On Air. Copyright Able 2014 TONIGHT ` THE HEAT'S ON JUDITH COLLINS AND THE PRESSURE'S ON THE PRIME MINISTER. HE'S STANDING BY HIS MINISTER, BUT FOR HOW LONG? EXPLOSIVE RIOTS IN FERGUSON AS PROTESTS CONTINUE OVER THE DEATH OF AN UNARMED BLACK TEEN BY A YOUNG WHITE POLICE OFFICER. AND OUR DANIELLE STANBURY GETS DOWN WITH THE SCENESTERS FOR A DROP OF CAPITAL CULTURE ` THE WELLINGTON WEB SERIES MAKING FUN OF ITS OWN. DUE TO THE LIVE NATURE OF TONIGHT, WE APOLOGISE FOR THE LACK OF CAPTIONS FOR SOME ITEMS. FROM SKATING ON THIN ICE TO HER LAST CHANCE. IT REALLY COULDN'T GET MUCH WORSE FOR JUDITH COLLINS. THE PRIME MINISTER HAS TODAY COME OUT WITH HIS STRONGEST CRITICISM YET OF THE EMBATTLED JUSTICE MINISTER. THAT'S AFTER AN EMAIL REVEALED SHE GAVE AN INTERNAL AFFAIRS OFFICIAL'S DETAILS TO BLOGGER CAMERON SLATER. POLITICAL EDITOR CORIN DANN IS ACROSS DEVELOPMENTS. THIS IS JOHN KEY PUBLICLY CRITICISING JUDITH COLLINS OVER HER PART IN 'DIRTY POLITICS'. I THINK THE PASSING OF THE PRIVATE INFORMATION, YOU KNOW, IN TERMS OF PHONE NUMBERS, I THINK THAT'S UNWISE. IT'S UNWISE OF A MINISTER. LOOK, IN THE END, YOU KNOW, IT'S ONE OF THOSE THINGS. FOR SIX DAYS NOW HE HAS STOOD BY MS COLLINS FOLLOWING ALLEGATIONS THAT SHE PASSED ON THE NAME AND CONTACT NUMBERS OF CIVIL SERVANT SIMON PLEASANTS TO BLOGGER CAMERON SLATER. HIS SHIFT IS SIGNIFICANT, SINCE HE'D ALREADY SIGNALLED MS COLLINS WAS ON THIN ICE AFTER HER DINNER WITH ORAVIDA EXECUTIVES AND A CHINESE BORDER OFFICIAL. IF SHE WAS ALREADY ON HER LAST CHANCE, > WHERE DO YOU DRAW THAT LINE? > WELL, IF YOU GO AND HAVE A LOOK AT THE BOOK, IT'S BASED ON A BUNCH OF HACKED EMAILS. I MEAN, THAT IN ITSELF IS KIND OF AN INTERESTING, NEW KIND OF PHENOMENON IN NZ POLITICS. THE LEFT HAVE DECIDED THAT IS HOW THEY ARE GOING TO ENGAGE IN THE ELECTION CAMPAIGN ` NOT ON THE POLICIES, BUT ON HACKED EMAILS. MS COLLINS INITIALLY INSISTED SHE ONLY PASSED ON MR PLEASANTS' NAME TO CAMERON SLATER. LATER SHE SAID IT WAS JUST HIS JOB TITLE. HOWEVER, AN EMAIL RELEASED BY THE MYSTERY HACKER TODAY APPEARS TO CONTRADICT THAT. IT SHOWS SHE PASSED ON MR PLEASANTS' PHONE NUMBERS, JOB TITLE AND NAME AND WAS SENT FROM HER PRIVATE EMAIL. CAMERON SLATER ALLEGEDLY WANTED THE DETAILS TO TRACE WHO'D LEAKED INFORMATION ABOUT FINANCE MINISTER BILL ENGLISH CLAIMING AN ACCOMMODATION ALLOWANCE HE WASN'T ENTITLED TO. MS COLLINS WOULDN'T COMMENT TODAY, AS POLICE ARE INVESTIGATING COMPLAINTS INTO THE HACKING OF CAMERON SLATER'S COMPUTER. SHE NEEDS TO BE SACKED. THERE IS NO WAY THAT JOHN KEY CAN KEEP BACKING JUDITH COLLINS.

Nigel Latta Killing Our Kids

Why are New Zealand's rates of family violence so high? This episode delves into the factors influencing our domestic violence rates and meets some of the people working towards making our communities safer.

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